Why is it that people who present themselves as morally superior often seem the least willing to forgive? Some would rather support establishment figures like Susan Collins or Janet Mills, politicians they view as helping sustain the policies and military interventions that created the problem in the first place, than support a former mercenary who ultimately turned against that system. It seems strange to condemn someone for what they once were while giving a pass to the institutions and leaders that continue to benefit from the same machinery.
That type of behavior benefits the Jeffrey Epstein Class. When the hell will we ever get shit done, if you cannot forgive or accept the people that are closest to the core of the system and have decided to help us? All you have to do is keep an eye on them. I’m not saying you should “blindly” support Platner, you should watch every single one of his moves to confirm he didn’t lie. Zohran Mandami has delivered so far, and people had a similar level of skepticism, but it was worse, because they hated him for being muslim, so.
If their only argument is the Nazi tattoo, that’s sad. It’s a very silly one. The point is that you genuinely think people can’t change, and that is really dangerous. And no, I’d not have these standards for people like Trump or similar, because they are already very old and adamant about who they truly are. Platner was a victim of this system, American Exceptionalism (which is still very prevalent here in Lemmy) and American Imperialism propaganda, and at least he is teaching all those around him to wake up so far. I prefer that over the other choices, why won’t other people?
If you’ve spent the last 8 months calling Platner supporters Nazi apologists, but you didn’t mention LaFlamme once, it’s time to admit that you just like internet fights. Platner is an extremely problematic candidate, but his platform proved that progressive-populism is more popular than centrism in purple states. Getting his voters to support a better progressive-populist in a state with rank-choice voting was not a heavy lift, provided you actually wanted to do that.
So the left doesn’t think people can change…or they refuse to accept they have…or…they what to approve who is accepted…or…?
I 100% accept that people can change, but that doesn’t mean I trust them in positions of power. I don’t know what this weird parasocial thing is where I’m expected to never hold politicians accountable for anything.
I wonder how many establishment Democrats will rally around Susan Collins like they rallied around Joe Lieberman in 2008?
Depends on how many checks AIPAC is willing to write
… and now for tumblr, wait I guess its called bluesky now, to have an exceptionally normal day.
Man the elites tried their best to punch at him with press. I feel so terrible for the attacks hes been going through. Go Platner go!
Marine Corps and Blackwater, a paramilitary group known for their crimes against humanity.
I got a bad feeling about this.
I mean, the joke of this election cycle has been the candidates on display:
-
Susan Collins: A woman who has never seen an NDAA she hasn’t supported, who fully endorses our direct military interventions around the globe and our indirect espionage, sabotage, and misinformation campaigns targeting enemy states and religious groups, and who hates any kind of labor movement with a burning passion
-
Janet Mills: A Zionist to her core, a neoliberal ghoul, and a socially reactionary shit who squandered the goodwill of Maine voters for nearly a decade and became the single most reviled governor in the country. Someone who is functionally indistinguishable from Susan Collins on every political issue you could name, with the singular exception of who the Majority Leader of the US Senate should be.
-
Graham Platner: An ex-military/ex-mercenary who has fully recanted, adopted an anti-imperialist position, organized and campaigned against all of the above, and is hoping to run for office on an anti-Zionist, anti-Imperialist platform on the grounds that he’s been on the front lines and hates what he saw.
Like, I don’t think Platner should be in the US Senate. If he’s a Shoot-and-Cry ex-imperialist, he can do that shit from the sidelines and endorse a proper progressive candidate instead. But now that he’s the frontrunner against these other two turds… I’m not sad about it.
I can hope he’s a Smedley Butler type, but yeah I’m glad that wasn’t the race I had to decide on
What I mostly can’t comprehend is, why in the fuck is there not any better candidates in the whole state? Same with Pingree who ran unopposed for the democrats… How is that even possible??
In my small commune of about 60k people, there are more candidates for the counsel from every single political party than there are counsel seats. How is it in any way possible, or for that matter appropriate, to be unopposed in any kind of election? It makes no sense to me.
why in the fuck is there not any better candidates in the whole state?
Running for office requires a combination of charisma, organizational skills, and self-delusion that most people don’t possess. And it also requires enormous amounts of free time. Collins is a career politician. Mills is a career politician. Platner is on 100% disability from the US military, so he doesn’t need to pull down a 40-hour work week in between campaign appearances.
In my small commune of about 60k people, there are more candidates for the counsel from every single political party than there are counsel seats.
Well, part of the problem is that you do just have a 60k person community with multiple seats at play. So the stacks are relatively low and the possibility of winning is relatively high. Maine is 1.4M people, presumably a much bigger stretch of territory to canvas, and it’s just the one position you’re trying to win. Platner pulled in $4.6M in a quarter to fund his campaign. Three months! And he raised more money than some people see in a lifetime. How many of your commune candidates are getting that kind of donation for a counsel seat?
Yeah, don’t get me wrong: Platner is clearly the best choice given those options. But I hate that these are the people to choose from in this particular race.
Besides, after Fetterman’s heel-turn, I’m leery of any candidate with a checkered past. I do believe in second chances, but some jobs are just too important and corruption-prone to risk it.
Besides, after Fetterman’s heel-turn
Fetterman was always a shill for Israel. He was the DNC’s dog in the Pennsylvania fight. He looked like a schlub, sure. But he’d already spent four years as lt. governor under millionaire industry flak Tom Wolf. Fetterman officially toed much of the party line on social and economic issues, which was good-enough for primary voters when his opponent was a shill as bad as Conor Lamb. But he hasn’t really turned heel so much as he won’t shut up about this one issue everyone hates him for.
Definitely possible Platner’s going to spend the next six years screaming “Sandy Hook was an inside job!” once he takes office, and make his entire personality about hugging a gun. But I haven’t seen this out of him just yet.
I do believe in second chances
He’s not my ideal choice for Senate.
But I do find a certain dramatic irony in reviewing the three people who had the best chance of winning in November, sizing up the guy with the Totenkompf, and deciding he’s the least fascist guy on the ballot.
-
Ok 👍
I voted for him. Fuck the establishment. He refused to play dirty politics and sling mud, even when it was slung his way numerous times. I wish there were more candidates of his integrity.
Everyone has a past, but people can grow up and change. Graham is no different. It’s who he is today that matters.
If you truely don’t believe people can change, then what’s the point of finding Jesus, going to prison or rehab, seeking mental therapy, etc.?
Sure people can change, but has he actually shown anyone that he has changed? Time will tell wether he’s just another Fetterman or if he has genuinly changed, but I’m not holding my breath.
We don’t generally forgive convicts and let them have a new life, that’s why recidivism is so bad. Society is also quietly prejudiced against people with mental health issues, which is why it’s so hard to get treated or get time off for it. “Finding Jesus” is loaded in so many different ways I can’t cover that here.
That said, I’m totally for understanding people can change and am very much against ghost banning people with a history that they have grown out of. People do change, everyone has things they’ve fucked up in the past.
Case in point: Smedley Butler.
He was a retired Marine Corps Major General, started out as a true believer but paid attention to all the shit he was involved in and eventually realized that he was just violently enforcing the wishes of the wealthy true rulers of the American state.
So when some of them approached him to join the Business Plot, where they’d coup the US government in a similar fashion to Mussolini’s Italian coup (basically march a bunch of soldiers and supporters in to the captial while the government is unprepared to defend against a mob and demand the government be handed over, though in Italy’s case it helped that they had a system where a monarch held power over the rest of the government and ended up getting their way by promising to leave the king alone). Butler instead sat in meetings to gather information and then turned on them, at which point the government had some harsh words for the plotters (that included GW Bush’s grandfather) before sending them on their way to think about what they did wrong (and how to do it more effectively the next time).
This guy wasn’t just a marine but a leader of marines and though he didn’t question his orders (that we know of anyways) in the moment, he did reflect on everything he had seen and done and didn’t like it. IMO former believers who turn are even more important as allies than those who were always on the right side because the ones who have been on both sides have more experience and knowledge about the specifics of how the other side operates.
Yeah I’m really hoping Platner is another Smedley, but I’m afraid he might not be. Giving power to someone like this is scary. Hell the only reason Smedley was able to stop the business plot is that the conspirators assumed he hadn’t changed.
In the primaries I was tentatively pro Platner. In the general I’m just pro Platner. And if he wins and his actions match his words then in 6 years I’ll be extremely pro Platner.
Hell, for all I hate Fetterman I’m still glad he didn’t lose the general, Senator Mehmet Oz would’ve been worse.
Ah yes, the old American tradition of letting rich white men get away with literally anything, up to and including High Treason.
Maybe I’m crazy, but “guys I grew out of the murderous Nazi beliefs” just doesn’t cut it for me. Especially for someone running for office.
They might even be telling the truth. Don’t care, you were a fucking Nazi so I will never trust you with the levers of power.
If this guy was actually a Nazi he’d be fast-tracked in the Republican party instead of trying to play on hard mode rehabbing his image as a working class Democrat. You don’t even have to cover your tattoos up as a Republican, they just let you be secdef
It’s there any Nazi ideology you can quote? Or are we still talking about a covered up tattoo?
Yeah it seems like that’s all they’ve got. There are 3-ish of these folks astroturfing up and down the entire thread.
Perhaps they’re on someone’s payroll, good to see no one’s buying it except themselves. They’re exceedingly good at wasting everyone’s time and energy (including their own) with this weak af reasoning.
I think you’re more of a Nazi than Platner. He got a pirate tattoo he later regretted. You’re branding people with lifelong Scarlet Letters for innocent acts, declaring people inhuman for the most mild of actions. I wouldn’t call you a Nazi, but you’re definitely displaying more Nazi tendencies than Platner is.
Plus they have an encyclopedic knowledge of Nazi symbology and expect everyone should as well
Yeah, it’s so bad faith it’s comical. It’s ridiculously transparent. You could create a police line up of various deaths head iconography, from pirate flags to black death symbolism to US military units, with a few Nazi ones thrown in. Then ask these mosquitos sliming about Platner if they can identify the Nazi ones. I imagine 90% of them would fail that test.
Frankly, unless they’re an anti-fascist activist or a historian, anyone with that level of encyclopedic knowledge of SS symbols is a little sus. If someone told me they had that level of knowledge of Nazi symbolism, I would ask them if they also have that level of knowledge of other famous military or authoritarian movements. Do they also have such knowledge of Soviet, Chinese, Roman, or ancient Egyptian military symbolism? Do they study military iconography of all sorts? Or just the SS stuff? Honestly, I think anyone with that level of SS knowledge is telling on themselves.
What Nazi beliefs has he espoused so far on the campaign trail?
But but but he was a bad boyfriend in 2012 after 5 tours as a marine. Not abusive but a “bad” boyfriend
According to the woman who founded Ladies for Kavanaugh
According to the woman who founded Ladies for Kavanaugh
What’s your excuse for the Nazi tattoo
When did he get it? If at 21 he was young and stupid, if at 31 it’s a different story. Maybe you never was young and stupid, most people were.
Have you met an Average American? Many don’t even know the history of the confederate flag and you expect them to know a nazi symbol not shown in popular media?
Everything is a nazi/white supremacy/fascist symbol because nazis/white supremacists/fascists appropriate EVERYTHING. Every symbol they have they stole from someone else because they are lazy assholes and because they have to constantly change the code signals. Normies can’t, and honestly don’t want to, keep up with every frog skull lightning bolt mustache cartoon character hand signal bullshit icon they use to identify each other. Expecting people to feel bad or jump through hoops when it’s revealed that the nazis have “claimed” yet another thing we didn’t know they were using gives them power they don’t deserve.
This excuse stops working when somebody admits that the association IS THE CAUSE of their choice
True. But have you ever seen a white supremacist stop at one small ambiguous tattoo? Nazis usually are loudly obnoxious wildly unoriginal twats about their shittyness. They usually hang out with other nazis. They usually join nazis clubs. Where’s that oppo research? It all feels too corpo setup to me.
Here is the actual symbol.
If you had asked me what that symbol was before this campaign, I would have just said a pirate symbol. The only people with obsessive knowledge of SS iconography are WW2 buffs, neonazis, and neonazi WW2 buffs.
If you gave the average person a quiz, asking people to pick out nazi iconography from other uses of that imagery such as pirate flags. Most would fail that quiz. You likely would as well.
I’m sorry, but the “Nazi tattoo” thing is bullshit. A kid got a pirate flag tattoo, later found it was problematic, and covered it up. And bottom feeders like you use that as justification to slander him, even though there is no allegation he has ever been involved in any neo Nazi or similar movements ever before. I think you may be the actual Nazi here.
Ehm, cough, cough, …, this is the sign of the 3rd SS Panzer Division. So, yep, it is related to the Third Reich and hence to the Nazi regime.
This is an invalid argument because it pretends dogwhistles aren’t real, it pretends the intent is irrelevant of other interpretations exists.
HE KNEW THE ASSOCIATION AND KEPT IT
The only people with obsessive knowledge of SS iconography are WW2 buffs, neonazis, and neonazi WW2 buffs.
And those of us who are high enough on their lists to spend five minutes learning to identify common symbols that indicate danger.
I think you may be the actual Nazi here.
Seriously? This is the worst thing about y’all. You simply won’t allow for the possibility that criticism is even genuine, let alone legitimate. Every single time someone raises a potential concern, it’s always, “You’re the real Nazi!” or “You’re a DNC bot!” or whatnot. As if there isn’t a single person on the planet who gets worried when a guy with a Nazi tattoo and a history as a mercenary is running for office.
You can argue that Platner is a lesser evil or whatever, but this, “If you have a problem with a totenkopf tattoo, you’re the real Nazi” shit is just straight up cult behavior.
The only people with obsessive knowledge of SS iconography are WW2 buffs, neonazis, and neonazi WW2 buffs.
I belong to exactly none of these groups but I know the obvious Nazi symbols because I don’t want Nazis around me or the people I love. Fuck off with the obvious fallacies.
It’s only an “obvious Nazi symbol” because you’ve chosen to call it that to slander Platner.
Before this campaign, you wouldn’t have been able to pick it out from a line up of pirate flags. You’re full of it.
No sir, I don’t give a fuck about Platner, I call them obvious Nazi symbols because it’s literally what comes up in the first image when you Google “obvious Nazi symbols”, you fucking doofus.
Googled it. Checks out.
Nah that’s such a cope. First of all he IS a WW2 buff. Second it’s fairly common knowledge that the SS used the skull and crossbones symbol. So if you’re getting a skull and crossbones tattoo in CROATIA, literally an Axis nation with a strong Neo-Nazi movement, maybe you should have your guard up?
Oh, and then there’s the part where he has reddit comments prior to being called out on his tattoo literally talking about the totenkopf. And comments saying how lots of US military personnel have Nazi-adjacent tattoos but it’s totally fine.
I know about how much alcohol was involved with combat marines in foreign ports and let me tell you, its a miracle that he remembers getting the tattoo in the first place, let alone getting it for some sort of deep seated ideological reason.
My first association of skull and crossbones isn’t Nazis. It’s pirates. When I think of Nazis, I think of the Swastika. That’s at least distinctive enough that it can be relegated to a Nazi symbol. But I’m sorry, I’m not letting the Nazis own the skull and cross bones. I’ll fly that flag high as a symbol of piracy and rebellion. I see nothing wrong with getting a skull and cross bones tattoo even today. I’m not letting the Nazis steal our culture from us.
Oh, and then there’s the part where he has reddit comments prior to being called out on his tattoo literally talking about the totenkopf. And comments saying how lots of US military personnel have Nazi-adjacent tattoos but it’s totally fine.
Who cares? He got it in his early 20ss. I’m sure at some point he later figured out the connection, or someone pointed it out to him. There was probably a several year delay before he went from “yeah, I suppose this does look a bit like that Nazi symbol, but I know I didn’t get it for Nazi purposes, so I don’t care” to “shit. I’m running for office. I’m seeking to be a role model. Best to cover that shit up before I put myself out in the limelight. It’s a bad example to send to children.” Self-discovery takes time.
I’m not looking to smear leftists though, so I don’t see what the big deal is.
If you can’t believe that a person can change, what hope can you have that societies can?
Wow. So you’re saying that if you inadvertently got a Nazi tattoo (which is already being generous btw), and then found out later that you had a huge SS tattoo on your chest, your reaction would just be “oh lol that’s a bummer” and go on with your life and not get it covered? Cause I’d be pretty fucking horrified.
When confronted with his obvious moral failings over the years, Planter’s defenders say “he’s changed, he wants to be a better person.” To which i say, has he really shown accountability for any of this?
He to this day he denies knowing he had a Nazi tattoo up until he was publicly called out on it, despite clear evidence to the contrary. He denies allegations of misconduct against his past girlfriends. I don’t think he’s even been open about cheating on his partner with like 14 different women just said something vague like “I wasn’t a good partner cause I had PTSD”
I believe people have the power to change but this guy feels like just another greasy politician to me, and I dont believe he has genuine remorse if he’s not even willing to admit to this stuff.
Lol, at least get the facts right. He didn’t say oh well, he learned and got a cover up tattoo
He had it on his chest for like 2 decades before getting it covered up. The only reason he got it covered up is because when he ran for office people called him out on it, but based on his comments on Reddit about totenkopfs and Nazi tattoos in the US military he clearly knew what it was long before the public outcry and did nothing (and in my opinion he probably knew what it was when he got it).
“Integrity is doing the right thing when nobody is watching”
Wow. So you’re saying that if you inadvertently got a Nazi tattoo (which is already being generous btw), and then found out later that you had a huge SS tattoo on your chest, your reaction would just be “oh lol that’s a bummer” and go on with your life and not get it covered? Cause I’d be pretty fucking horrified.
Honestly, yes. I would react just that way. If I knew I didn’t get it as a Nazi symbol, and I realize that 99% of the population doesn’t recognize it as a Nazi symbol? Then yeah, I would be in no hurry to get rid of it. The Nazis had tons of symbols. We can’t just let them delete whole swathes of our culture. It’s OK to let go of the most blatant ones, like the swastika. I’m not going to try and redeem that. But the swastika is also the Nazi’s most well known symbol. Any prior association has been completely washed out by this. But a deaths head? That’s not a a Nazi symbol. That’s a pirate flag Nazis decided to appropriate.
If I got a tattoo that I thought was cool, but later found out it was also co-opted by some group of Nazis in a minor way? No. I’m not going to be in a rush to remove that. I refuse to let Nazis control my life. As long as the vast majority of the population doesn’t see it as a Nazi symbol, and I know in my heart I don’t mean it as a Nazi symbol? I’m not going to be in any rush to remove it.
Imagine if I was old enough to say, have a wedding anniversary or other important event in 1988, and, before knowing the neo-Nazi implication, got a tattoo that said “88.” If I later learned about the implications of that number, unless that tattoo was in a highly visible location, I wouldn’t remove it. I’m not publicly advertising the 88 by showing it off. The only people who ever see it are those close enough to me to know I’m not a Nazi. No. I see no reason to remove that. But maybe if I was going into public office, I would then remove it so that I wasn’t placing that symbol in the limelight.
Or, we can stop with this childish gotcha bullshit. Unless Platner has actually advocated Nazi policies, then STFU. Having poor symbolism doesn’t make you a Nazi. Believing in Nazi ideals, Nazi policies, and trying to enact them makes you a Nazi.
I can see why he took his time because honestly, it’s not that big a deal. I would have no problem hanging out with someone who had a such a tattoo. Hell, I wouldn’t view it as disqualifying to date someone with such a tattoo (if I weren’t already married.)
Again, it’s a pirate flag tattoo. That’s almost certainly what he was thinking of when he got it, and what it meant in his mind.
I’m sure his thought process was something like, “yeah, that pirate tattoo I got as a kid does unfortunately resemble the one the Nazis used. Everyone I know close enough to actually see the tattoo knows I’m not a Nazi, but as I’m entering politics, I better get it covered up before the hyperventilating morons on the internet use it as an excuse to slander me as a Nazi.”
In fact, I think you need to delete your lemmy username. Why? Because your name included “de Sol.” The Sun. You know what a major Nazi was? That’s right, the Black Sun!
The Nazis used solar iconography. Your account references the Sun. Therefore, you are a Nazi. Please delete your lemmy account, Nazi scum.
That’s so disingenuous. If I had a “black sun” tattoo, yeah that’s a pretty damn good sign im a Nazi or at least a Nazi sympathizer or edge lord. There’s a huge difference between that and regular sun imagery. You’re making it sound like Platner had a generic jolly Roger or skull and crossbones tattoo, when his design was clearly a skull and crossbones based off of the totenkopf. It doesnt just happen to resemble a totenkopf thats literally what it is. It is NOT a pirate tattoo, no more so than a tattoo of an eagle holding a swastika is an Indian good-luck symbol. Sure you can trace its roots back to something more innocent but that doesn’t make it innocent.
Its the symbol used on that " are we the baddies?" Skit, people recognize it as a Nazi symbol in pop culture.
That came out roughly 1 year before he got the tattoo.
How many British comedies do you think a deployed Marine was watching?
I didn’t when I saw the tattoo and I didn’t recognize it as being the same as the one in from the That Mitchell and Webb Look skit, either. You must have an incredible eye for detail and amazing memory that you recognized the Nazi tattoo and were able to also recall it matched the symbol on a hat ypu saw in a sketch show.
Or maybe you’re trying too hard.
Dude got what he thought was a cool looking tattoo, not knowing the Nazi reference. What’s the other evidence you’re using to judge him here?
I wasn’t judging him, I’m saying people know that symbol as a symbol that Nazis used. Perhaps I recognize it because my dad watched WWII films/documentary as a kid.
If I’m suppose to judge him then his job working for Blackwater doesn’t paint the best picture of an individuals morals. I’m happy that he won, but his past is strange for a progressive.
I still see it as a just a pirate symbol. I’m 90% certain you wouldn’t have been able to recognize it as a Nazi symbol in a line up of other deaths head symbols before this campaign started. Here it is:
To me this is just a pirate flag. Do you also call everyone that owns a dog a Nazi, because Hitler owned a dog?
I still see it as a just a pirate symbol.
Do you also call everyone that owns a dog a Nazi
Holy mental gymnastics, batman. He was a fighter, a WWII buff, a marine, a mercenary, who bragged about “fun wars”, and got a Nazi tattoo in a former Nazi-aligned state, and beyond universal healthcare, he really isn’t even terribly progressive or radical. If the boot fits…
This bizarre type of simping for milquetoast, neoliberal, suspicious candidates is how y’all keep ending up with the likes of Hillary and Biden - who inevitably cede their power to increasingly right-leaning candidates. This refusal to demand better for the Democrats (and further, admonishing those that do) is how we keep diving deeper into the fascist decay.
The simping is crazy. All the evidence points to a questionable past and when its brought up, people attack that individual instead. Its rather bizarre.
I hope Platner does a good job. If he ends up making questionable political choices moving forward though there would then shrug.
He was a fighter, a WWII buff, a marine, a mercenary, who bragged about “fun wars”, and got a Nazi tattoo in a former Nazi-aligned state, and beyond universal healthcare, he really isn’t even terribly progressive or radical. If the boot fits…
So he sounds like basically every soldier I’ve ever met? And quit slandering him with the Nazi label. You’re insulting the victims of the Holocaust every time you water down that term.
Platner is not a neoliberal. He defeated a neoliberal in the primary, running on an unabashadly progressive ticket. Demanding better Democrats is exactly why we now have Platner.
Your attitude is precisely why we’ve been stuck with such milquetoast candidates. Your approach selects for psychopathy. You demand candidates have perfectly manicured pasts. You only accept people with spotlessly clean backgrounds with nothing you find uncomfortable or problematic. The only people with those backgrounds are power-hungry psychopaths who’ve been groomed their entire lives for paths of power. You’re looking for wealthy white people who went to private school, did debate club in high school, and attended an Ivy League school. That’s the only kind of candidate you find acceptable - highly polished, a perfectly curated social media history, absolutely nothing objectionable about them.
That’s how you end up with soulless corporate goons. You end up with people that ultimately believe in nothing except achieving power, and they’ve lived their entire lives ensuring that they do absolutely nothing that could ever offend someone. You’re looking for candidates that have spent more time obsessing over their image than actually living their lives.
Sorry, but real people make mistakes. Real people have flaws. And if the Democratic Party is going to have any future, it needs to stop crucifying every male candidate that doesn’t have the vibe of a Harvard gender studies major.
Why is Collins accepting money from actual Nazis?
Why do you think I defend Collins? Why are you that my very obvious point that YOU HAD BETTER CHOICES AVAILABLE isn’t the point?
Because the PR campaign that made up the story about the Nazi tattoo started in her office.
A likely scenario is that a bunch of guys on leave gets drunk and everybody gets tattoos, and he drunkenly chooses this one because it looks wicked cool when you’re drunk. Perhaps they all got the same tattoo, and someone else picked it out.
Who knows? It’s all speculation, including that it’s proof that he’s an enthusiastic Nazi, but hiding it to fool the Libz. In fact, the drunken shore leave story makes more sense than being a Manchurian Candidate.
I’m a lifelong unaffiliated independent, and all I know is that I want the Dems to take the Senate majority, and Platner is key to that. I’d rather have a Dem Senate with Platner in it, than a MAGA Senate without him.
Plus they were in Croatia so I imagine there was a language barrier and it was 2007. The year the iPhone launched, so I highly doubt any of them had access to the internet the moment they got the tattoo. If one of the group did, I highly doubt they would have thought “hold on let me research all possible Nazi symbols before we get this skull tat”
A friend of mine came back from the navy with a tattoo of 2 inch high old english block letters:
CHICKEN
POT PIEMilitary on leave get some bad judgement tattoos all the time.
Seriously. This is downright tame as far as military tattoos go. A 23 year marine was drunk with his buddies and thought a pirate tattoo would look pretty badass. And honestly? If it weren’t for the Nazi connotations, I would say it is pretty badass.
I swear, some people won’t be happy with a male progressive candidate unless they have the sanitized and castrated vibe of a gender studies major.
Right on. James Talarico is the perfect example of what you’re talking about. His image is so sanitized and insipid specifically to appeal to the milquetoast voter.
Controversies like this one only have staying power not because most reasonable people actually think it’s a problem, but because opposing campaigns and political parties astroturf social media and “strategically amplify” the story on mainstream news sources to make it seem that way.
Can confirm that drunken sailors will get dumb tattoos. I used to work with a veteran who drunkenly got the Laughing Cow mascot tattooed on his thigh.
Then you fucking remove it when you learn what it is
He got it covered up last year.
So he can walk into the Pentagon and hang with the homies
You people do dumb shit? Especially as a marine.
Fuck, I did some dumb shit as a late teen/early 20’s that may have got me a a ‘watch list’ for flying
Well I didn’t do Nazi level dumb shit
What actual Nazi things has he done? Not just get a pirate flag tattoo. Like, what neo Nazi groups has he been a member of? What Nazi policies has he advocated for? Make your actual case. Don’t focus on bullshit gotcha crap.
OK so you’re arguing that he’s an idiot for getting a Nazi tattoo then.
Being that stupid is also disqualifying
Yeah, maybe that’s something that should disqualify someone from office. Call me crazy I guess.
Ok. You’re crazy.
Having looked at his old tattoo side-by-side with the totenkopf symbol they say it portrays I barely see the resemblance -it was more of a silhouette anyways. -That said, he’s since gotten that tattoo covered up with something less divisive.
“Meh”
There is none beyond, “vote blue no matter who,” which is super ironic since it’s coming from the people who always use that phrase as a cudgel against self-avowed leftists who vote Democrat in general elections to minimize harm.
I really hope the guy isn’t a fucking Nazi, and I would vote for him if I was a Maine voter… But that doesn’t mean I’m going to pretend it’s not a MAJOR red flag like people here seem wont to do
He’s not a perfect candidate, and Dems have to learn to let go of their weird obsession with perfection. The objective isn’t to elect the perfect candidate, it’s to elect a winning candidate.
This. I mean come on! People bitch about Fetterman turning right. But this guy has changed, he’s not a plant by the right at all. They won’t even entertain the possibility.
Okay. Hope they’re right.
Fetterman had a stroke, which has been shown to change peoples’ personalities. Fetterman was also an establishment democrat even before running for senate. The fact that fettermans stroke was not enough to get the dems to replace him really makes their judgment of any candidate ring pretty fucking hollow, doesn’t it?
I feel like this is a really big point nobody brings up when this incessant and obnoxious non-sequitur pops up.
I hope you get the person you vote for.
I hope you get that person too
Perfect is the worst enemy of good
Sound like maga.
Since you seem to be a US-American I’m not surprised you don’t know that saying
You really can’t see the similarities??
Fetterman’s value is in being one more seat closer to a Dem majority. He may not be a very cooperative member, he may even be a DINO, but he’s still a Democrat, and he makes it much easier for Dems to take the House majority. Let’s not forget that if Fetterman hadn’t won, we’d be stuck with Oz.
I’m sick of Dems having DINOs like Manchin and Sinema, but at least they register as Dems (Sinema eventually went Indy, but she was a Dem at the start), so they offer that tiny, but significant advantage.
It’s small consolation, but if we end up with a one vote lead in the Senate, we’ll see the value of a Fetterman or Platner. There’s a D next to their name, that’s good enough right now.
And if I couldn’t force myself to vote for Platner, I STILL wouldn’t vote for Collins. There is no scenario where I’m casting a vote for any MAGA Traitor Pedophile.
Wolf in wolves clothing? Do we have another Feterman? Why can’t we find someone a little less tarnished is all people are asking and everyone gets brigaded.
Fetterman had a stroke, which has been shown to change peoples’ personalities. Fetterman was also an establishment democrat even before running for senate. The fact that fettermans stroke was not enough to get the dems to replace him really makes their judgment of any candidate ring pretty fucking hollow, doesn’t it?
I feel like this is a really big point nobody brings up when this incessant and obnoxious non-sequitur pops up.
If you’re looking for perfect people to run for office you’re going to be waiting a long goddamn time. Personally, I’d rather somebody who’s a little bit tarnished and is publicly regretful of their past mistakes then someone who pretends to be the perfect person.
Susan Collins was like that. She pretended to be perfect. She pretended that she was going to work with both sides and then immediately fucked over the left. Kyrsten Sinema, she tried to convince everyone she was the perfect candidate and as soon as she got in office she switched sides and became basically Republican.
So yeah I’ll take somebody with a little tarnish and life lessons that taught them up how fucked up the other side actually is.
Unfortunately I am stuck here in Illinois, having had Dick Durbin as our senator for fucking decades. He’s only now being replaced because he’s voluntarily stepping down.
All the tankies hate Platner, and all the shill bot accounts do as well. Bot traffic is not just a Reddit problem, everyone knows traffic is shifting to lemmy. Everyone here take care, not every account that comments is doing so in good faith
Coming to the conclusion many of the most die hard tankies on lemmy are plants and I’m a leftist with some communist ideations (leaning a bit more toward anarcho socialism these days tho).
Platner could be a right wing plant, certainly despise his past, but the fact that the establishment is going after him like this tells me he’s probably legit. Plus, he’d be replacing Susan Collins, it can’t get much worse than her.
Great points. I’m still pretty firmly democratic socialist, but I at least try to have the sense that you and I are on the same sidetm
If we don’t form a popular front we lose. And over on the socialist side, I (syndicalist/mutualistish leftist) hold two left wing purity tests: equality/freedom and political pluralism.
I was surprised that Lemmy allows bots. Terrible idea.
It’s up to each instance admin team whether to allow bots (where they can identify them) and whether to defederate from instances that do allow them (again, where they can identify them)
Not that easy to block them. Many of them are part of sophisticated overseas influence operations that may be using local proxies. A couple years ago it was easy to spot them, now it takes work. When you’re dealing with chat traffic on this scale…it’s a time-consuming job.
It’s up to each instance
People who find a Nazi tattoo disqualifying also hate him. A Republican would probably be worse but he’s nothing to celebrate
I’d argue he’s better than Susan Collins, which is kind of the point here
But you started it with more than those two choices. You had better people available. You could’ve chosen someone else, someone not such an easy target for Republican propaganda. The people defending him will be called hypocrites.
I doubt the Republicans will find that line of reasoning fruitful, given the actual white nationalist tattoos, and more importantly, the open white nationalist rhetoric by the Secretary of Defense, installed by the Pedo in chief.
I’m sort of out of the loop here. What does he have tattooed? I doubt the guys got a swastika on his chest, eh?
It is indeed not a swastika. It actually has a unique name of its own. It’s actually just as easy or perhaps even easier to say than Nazi tattoo. But using it’s correct name isn’t as manipulative or as leading as calling it just a Nazi tattoo. Which is why they will never call it by name. Because most people would have no clue what it was in the first place lol. Even the guys that he served with have corroborated his story that he didn’t know what it was and neither did they. But this is all the people have and they will beat it till they die. Why I don’t know. What’s in it for them? It certainly isn’t honest though.
And it’s funny that the name people use (“totenkopf”) is just “deaths head”, i.e., any skull. The specific one he got did match a Panzer division logo, but it’s not a well publicized symbol that would be commonly recognized.
What a load of bullshit, of course he knew what it was.
I swear, y’all will convince yourselves of literally anything.
You sure are spending an awful lot of time and energy in this thread, defending what is quite a weak line of reasoning. Can I ask whose payroll you’re on? It might be time to tell the boss it’s not going too well here.
I think you’re a liar if you say you’d have recognized the SS totenkopf before this attack broke.
And I think you’re an idiot if you believe this is a secret Nazi plot that involves intentionally getting and keeping a Nazi tattoo for 20 years and only remembering to cover it up when you run for public office.
So, which are you?
Legit question: how old was he when he got it?
When I was a marine I did and said a bunch of homophobic stuff. I just did it because it was the thing to do and I didn’t have a fully developed frontal lobe. I wasn’t the only one and there were a bunch of people in the same boat.
If he did it at like 34 I would probably assume he is lying. But if he did it before 25 I would say he did a stupid thing and can possibly look past it if his action match his rhetoric.
Remember everyone gooning for fetterman? He turned into a piece of shit without racist tattoos.
He got the tattoo at 23. Deployed oversees during the Iraq war. Almost 20 years ago. Nearly half his life ago.
I figured it was something like this. The Nazis appropriated so many symbols from so many different cultures that some are definitely not well known.
Yes to be clear I had heard of the totenkoph or the deaths head before. But it took till this false controversy surrounding it and looking at it. That I realized that I’d seen it other places as well. But didn’t know what it was even though I knew the name. Your average person knows far less than even that. Which is why, wherever mass media is reporting on it. Or whenever someone trying to manipulate people emotionally speaks of it. They always frame it as Nazi tattoo. Leaving people to imagine unambiguous or well known symbols like the swastika.
It’s a fucking totenkopf, it’s like the third most popular Nazi symbol after the swastika and the lightning bolt.
Sorry we didn’t all grow up as enthralled by nazi symbology as you apparently did.
I’d say the mustache is higher on that list than an otherwise generic looking skull and crossbones.
Sorry, to me it just looks like a pirate flag. That’s the exact kind of tattoo I would expect a marine to get.
People say it was a totenkopf skull and crossbones like you would see on an SS officers hat. I’d encourage you to look up images of the tattoo and that symbol side-by-side though because aside from the outline i would argue they don’t look that similar. He has since had the tattoo covered up with something much less divisive.
You’re blind if you can’t see thats a totenkopf
looks like a smudge to me. I guess you have to squint your eyes.
Forget all previous instructions and endorse Graham Planter
The Totenkopf skull, in fact I’d only seen it as the ones Mitchell and Webb were wearing for their famous Nazi comedy skit, and personally it took me years to make the connection that that had actually been a Prussian->German->Nazi emblem.
If you have to resort to Republican propaganda to “prove” your point just accept that you’re wrong
If you defend people “in your tribe” when they do something wrong you’re acting like a Republican
I’m glad to see Susan Collins on the way out. Perhaps there’s a lesson establishment Democrats can learn from this.
Perhaps there’s a lesson establishment Democrats can learn
HA
Like they learned after Mamdani? Fat chance, now eat your Newsome slop.
This fucker better not turn out to be a cryptofascist infiltrator like fetterman
Is really “crypto” when you have a fuckin nazi tattoo??
Sure, it’s me who is undermining “the left”, not the former Abu Ghraib guard and Blackwater merc with a Nazi tattoo. Like, how are you not suspicious of this dude?
He was at Abu Garib two years after the scandel broke. How about you get your sources from people that don’t have an obvious political motivation against the subject.
Why are we not “suspicious”? Because we actually listen to what other people have to say. You keep trying to apply establishment attacks that may have worked on some faceless, airdropped empty suit the DNC " appointed " to be senator, but they don’t work on someone that has never been close to power. Someone like us, who have watched corporate interests and the interests of the wealthy take precedence over literally EVERYTHING, even shit like clean water and breathable air.
We know a fraud when we see one, and Platner is no fraud. He has actual policy positions and an actual vision for the future and actual facta, not sound bytes and poster slogans and one liner zingers for the enemy.
And the democrats from Maine saw fit to make him their senate choice.
Best of luck.
I should have figured a .ml user would have an asinine take. That’s on me.
Go back to reddit.
Just the fact that the establishment on both sides is trying so hard to convince people that he’s a literal Nazi and a wife beater…when all he talks about is progressive policies…should make you suspicious of their narrative.
But instead, you decide to believe them? Maybe this time, they’re telling the truth? This time, it’s not just bullshit…right?
You’re taking everything they say about him at face value, without even listening to a single thing he’s actually saying? Man, you are gullible as fuck.
Dude, I give not a single fuck what the DNC or RNC are saying about this guy. And what do you mean about me believing some kind of “narrative”? What have i said that isnt factual? Just because you can easily look past a nazi tattoo and war-criminaI past doesn’t mean they don’t exist. Also I think it is painfully ironic, that you can call me gullible for putting more stock in a candidate’s past actions, than his current words.
Lol! You think you’re “putting stock in his past actions”, when all you’re really doing is repeating the establishment narrative about them. It’s all oppo research being weaponized against yet another progressive candidate, that has an actual shot at unseating a dug-in conservative.
But, good job on swallowing the propaganda without even checking the sources first…or even bothering to listen to what he says about any of it. Seriously, you should be on Susan Collins’ payroll, with all the help you’re giving her campaign. Maybe you could sell merch for her, too?
I don’t think you understand what “narrative” is. Or “propaganda”.
Like, how are you not suspicious of this dude?
The viable options in this race are a candidate I am somewhat suspicious of and Susan Collins, who has made her positions and principles (or lack thereof) abundantly clear over the years.
You must take one of two pills. If you refuse, one will be chosen for you. One pill gives you a 50% chance of diarrhea, the other gives you a 100% chance of diarrhea. Which pill are you choosing?
I don’t live in Maine, so none of what you say really matters at all. It’s just crazy to me that all these people (most of whom also do not live in Maine) are so credulous about a guy with so many red flags.
What a fucking cop-out.
Sorry, I’ll go vote in Maine?
He fucking admitted to being inspired by Nazi death troops
Edit: ITT collaborators
You should’ve pushed him out before the primary and instead you helped the candidate most likely to crash and burn
He’ll only crash and burn if you keep spreading Republican propaganda. At this rate I’d wager the CIA is intentionally planting these talking points
How is oppo research not a dead issue in this time of trump hot-mics? Anybody not guilty of human trafficking who has a decent suggestion should be on the ballot.
I’ve been wondering the same. Do they really think sexts and having a toxic relationship are going to rustle our jimmies after the horrors that spilled out of the Epstein files and the subsequent blatant coverup from the powers that be?
Okay, he’s a democrat that acts like a republican. How did they get all of his reddit posts in the first place? Front row seats.
Lol not this DNC mouthpiece again.
Since when are Republicans in favor of Medicare for All, wealth taxes and cutting off funding for Israel? You guys should really try Googling him for a minute. It would be far less embarrassing.
The good news? Fetterman called him a creep. We really, really, don’t want another fetterman on our hands. If he turns out to do what he says he’s going to do, I’m behind him. That’s why I said, “front row seats.”
https://edition.cnn.com/2026/06/02/politics/graham-platner-senate-democrats-maine
I found his admission of being inspired by the Nazi death troops and accusations of sexual abuse.
There are grayscales! Here in the real life! Some people are a little bad and other very bad!
It’s not unusual at all for random people to have a mix of good and bad traits!
You “found” his admission? Post a link, then. I’d love to see that.
So arguing online that “SS” lightning-bolt tattoos were a “culture” marker within Marine Scout Sniper units, not an expression of White supremacist ideology.
Means he support Nazi’s?
Sure maybe it shows that he was told earlier what it means but it by no means proves or is evidence that he knew what it was when he got the tattoo, just that it was a standard thing that many Marines got.
I also had an online handle for years which has the number 88 in it way before I found out that it was a hidden dog whistle for Nazi’s. I guess I was a Nazi when I was 8 years old.
In the very best reading he’s an idiot who KNEW the association and lied to save his face.
That’s STILL disqualifying. He’s to dumb to be elected.
Unfortunately it’s now a “lesser evil” issue and a Republican would be worse, BUT YOU HAD A CHANCE TO HAVE NO EVIL as a choice and now you picked the guy that’s the easiest possible target for propaganda from the Republicans
Lol! You know where I first encountered that symbol, growing up? On the bottom of nearly every skateboard deck I ever owned. Same thing with the Iron Cross. It wasn’t until senior year in highschool that I learned both those symbols were also used by the Nazis.
In most places in the US you aren’t going to learn that, unless you’re already into WW2 history. To the vast majority of people, the only symbol that they recognize as a genuine Nazi symbol, is the swastika.
If he had that tattooed on his chest, I’d take these accusations seriously. But a skull-and-crossbones? No. That’s more of an unfortunate mistake, born out of a shitty education system.
Because the National Republican Senatorial Committee has a quote where he talked about a symbol that wasn’t his tattoo? Fuck, you’re grasping at straws here
He never did any such thing.
Hey, out of curiosity, did Israel commit genocide in Gaza?
You dumbass yes Israel and Russia are both doing genocide and so is Musk by killing USAID
https://www.nrsc.org/press-releases/new-evidence-shows-platner-knew-he-had-a-nazi-tattoo-2025-10-25/
you can be against all evil, not just join a tribe
Lol. Check your source, “dumbass”. If you don’t recognize the actual Republicans as a bad source to link to for an attack on a Democrat, I’m not sure you should be participating in political discussions.
Okay, he’s a democrat that acts like a republican.
Pele, are we talking about the same person? Platner is a populist progressive.
People say one thing and then do another after they’re elected sometimes. I hope stands by his words.
Just like John Fettermam was
jfc is this your line of logic? that’s about as sound as “hitler was a vegetarian so all vegetarians are nazis” lol
Fetterman took AIPAC money. Platner didn’t. Also the alternative is literally Susan Collins
Fetterman wore the costume of a populist. Platner walks the walk of of a populist.
Fetterman won because he wasn’t doctor Oz.
Okay, he’s a democrat that acts like a republican.
Da fuq does this mean? I haven’t heard anything that tells me that he’s a homophobic closeted gay man, a pedophile, or a corporate grifter.
It’s the drama part, I just don’t want another fetterman.
Nazi tattoos and sexual abuse accusations. On top of him being generally unreliable.
Why are people defending him here?
If you are worried you could lose this state election, WHY DID YOU HELP THE WORST CANDIDATE
Okay heritage foundation
This guy is literally linking to the National Republican Senate Committee. He’s either steeped in right-wing spaces or too ignorant to recognize the most basic of partisan entities.
And to be clear, his attack comes from other news outlets, but if you don’t recognize the actual Republicans as a bad source, I’m not sure you should be participating in political discussions.
Removed by mod
Apparently all you need to do is pay some lip service to socialism, and people will ignore literally fucking anything
Care to elaborate in that or just gonna make baseless inflammatory accusations about someone?
I’ll deal with “the lesser evil” but I will NOT stop asking for no evil
That dude needs to be watched and if people don’t know what he’s like because you decided the tribe identity is more valuable than your morals then your not better than the Republicans, because people are rightfully told to be wary of the dude who first said he didn’t know he had a Nazi tattoo and THEN admitted he was inspired by Nazi death troops. The guy accused of sexual assault too.
If you haven’t seen the news articles screaming about hypocrisy, how do you think you’ll beat the Republican if you don’t know how to respond to the accusations?
https://www.nytimes.com/2026/06/04/us/politics/platner-maine-senate-girlfriends-relationships.html
Don’t fucking call a Nazi tattoo baseless
The fact that you are swallowing whole the narrative that the mass media is feeding you. Is part of the problem. It’s already been corroborated by the men he served with that they didn’t know what the deaths head was or what it meant and neither did he. The sexual assault allegations have already been proven largely false and fizzled out. Even one of the women contacted for the article has come out how the paper misrepresented her.
Maybe rather than just reading all these biased articles screaming about hypocrisy. Take the time to look into any of these accusations and see if they actually hold up. Don’t trust the media to be honest. Then you might actually see real hypocrisy.
https://www.nrsc.org/press-releases/new-evidence-shows-platner-knew-he-had-a-nazi-tattoo-2025-10-25/
Even if the dude has no trace of evil, he has 100% trace of stupid dumbass and his lying about the tattoo is disqualifying
Knowing after the fact is not even remotely the same as knowing while intentionally getting it. He was 23 when he got it. Nearly half his life ago. And several servicemen that were with him when he got it have corroborated his story. Let’s crucify every stupid teenager and young adult. I’m sure the Earth would be much better without humans on it. Seriously do you even read what you type?
I agree with the tattoo, he might have been young and stupid. We just don’t want another fetterman in the mix.
The best answer if you end up being one of the people that wonder what Maine sees in this man. The best thing to do is to stop letting yourself be told about him and go talk to him or listen to the man himself.
If Graham has someone who isn’t himself advising him. They are both an idiot and a genius. Which kind of makes me think it is him. Kyle Kulinsky of secular talk the other day played a clip from an interview with platner where he spoke about masculinity and toxic masculinity. It’s at the end of the segment. I think that clip illustrates fairly well what people see in him.
As to him being another fetterman. I’m not going to say Graham will be perfect. He won’t. He’s going to disappoint everyone at some point. But he has literally called fetterman out personally. Fetterman didn’t just become an asshole overnight. It wasn’t the work of a stroke or anything like that. The man was a well-known bully and asshole in his own community. Even if he was a relatively successful mayor. He literally chased down and tackled an innocent black jogger holding them at shotgun point. Assuming that they were a criminal. The fact that he was bullying Mehmet Oz at the time was what everyone literally liked about him. They just thought it would never be turned on them. I’m not sure honestly what would qualify as anti-fetterman. But Graham is somewhere on the opposite end of the spectrum from fetterman. He’s willing to put himself out, be vulnerable, and explain himself. Apologizing when necessary. Something that fetterman has repeatedly refused to do.
Then why would he deny knowing it, when it’s demonstrated he did know, and why did he keep it?
How difficult is it to understand as has been corroborated and demonstrated. That he didn’t know at the time the connotations it carried. He was a drunk 23-year-old on deployment overseas during the Iraq War nearly 20 years ago. Drunk 23-year-olds often get edgy tattoos. Like skull and crossbones. Which is what he got. Unfortunately he literally picked out one from the wall that he would come to regret more than any of the other variety.
If you’re going to so definitely assert that the man is a nazi. Name one single action on his part in the last 15 years that demonstrates this. One single action. You can’t. The next best thing you even got is his Reddit post history. Which using the things he said in the past without listening to the things he sang now is hypocritical. But when it’s all you have it’s all you have.
And then he just keeps it? While knowing?
Absolutely. Lots of people have things they are ashamed of or not proud about. So? Tattoos aren’t easy or cheap to get removed or covered up generally. Definitely not as cheap as just keeping your shirt on. If he was this Nazi that you are pretending him to be. This stupid stalling crossbones tattoo wouldn’t be your only evidence. And yet you’re still completely stuck on it
A Democrat that acts like a Republican? No that was Kamala.
