Have you met an Average American? Many don’t even know the history of the confederate flag and you expect them to know a nazi symbol not shown in popular media?
Everything is a nazi/white supremacy/fascist symbol because nazis/white supremacists/fascists appropriate EVERYTHING. Every symbol they have they stole from someone else because they are lazy assholes and because they have to constantly change the code signals. Normies can’t, and honestly don’t want to, keep up with every frog skull lightning bolt mustache cartoon character hand signal bullshit icon they use to identify each other. Expecting people to feel bad or jump through hoops when it’s revealed that the nazis have “claimed” yet another thing we didn’t know they were using gives them power they don’t deserve.
True. But have you ever seen a white supremacist stop at one small ambiguous tattoo? Nazis usually are loudly obnoxious wildly unoriginal twats about their shittyness. They usually hang out with other nazis. They usually join nazis clubs. Where’s that oppo research? It all feels too corpo setup to me.
If you had asked me what that symbol was before this campaign, I would have just said a pirate symbol. The only people with obsessive knowledge of SS iconography are WW2 buffs, neonazis, and neonazi WW2 buffs.
If you gave the average person a quiz, asking people to pick out nazi iconography from other uses of that imagery such as pirate flags. Most would fail that quiz. You likely would as well.
I’m sorry, but the “Nazi tattoo” thing is bullshit. A kid got a pirate flag tattoo, later found it was problematic, and covered it up. And bottom feeders like you use that as justification to slander him, even though there is no allegation he has ever been involved in any neo Nazi or similar movements ever before. I think you may be the actual Nazi here.
The only people with obsessive knowledge of SS iconography are WW2 buffs, neonazis, and neonazi WW2 buffs.
And those of us who are high enough on their lists to spend five minutes learning to identify common symbols that indicate danger.
I think you may be the actual Nazi here.
Seriously? This is the worst thing about y’all. You simply won’t allow for the possibility that criticism is even genuine, let alone legitimate. Every single time someone raises a potential concern, it’s always, “You’re the real Nazi!” or “You’re a DNC bot!” or whatnot. As if there isn’t a single person on the planet who gets worried when a guy with a Nazi tattoo and a history as a mercenary is running for office.
You can argue that Platner is a lesser evil or whatever, but this, “If you have a problem with a totenkopf tattoo, you’re the real Nazi” shit is just straight up cult behavior.
The only people with obsessive knowledge of SS iconography are WW2 buffs, neonazis, and neonazi WW2 buffs.
I belong to exactly none of these groups but I know the obvious Nazi symbols because I don’t want Nazis around me or the people I love. Fuck off with the obvious fallacies.
No sir, I don’t give a fuck about Platner, I call them obvious Nazi symbols because it’s literally what comes up in the first image when you Google “obvious Nazi symbols”, you fucking doofus.
Nah that’s such a cope. First of all he IS a WW2 buff. Second it’s fairly common knowledge that the SS used the skull and crossbones symbol. So if you’re getting a skull and crossbones tattoo in CROATIA, literally an Axis nation with a strong Neo-Nazi movement, maybe you should have your guard up?
Oh, and then there’s the part where he has reddit comments prior to being called out on his tattoo literally talking about the totenkopf. And comments saying how lots of US military personnel have Nazi-adjacent tattoos but it’s totally fine.
I know about how much alcohol was involved with combat marines in foreign ports and let me tell you, its a miracle that he remembers getting the tattoo in the first place, let alone getting it for some sort of deep seated ideological reason.
My first association of skull and crossbones isn’t Nazis. It’s pirates. When I think of Nazis, I think of the Swastika. That’s at least distinctive enough that it can be relegated to a Nazi symbol. But I’m sorry, I’m not letting the Nazis own the skull and cross bones. I’ll fly that flag high as a symbol of piracy and rebellion. I see nothing wrong with getting a skull and cross bones tattoo even today. I’m not letting the Nazis steal our culture from us.
Oh, and then there’s the part where he has reddit comments prior to being called out on his tattoo literally talking about the totenkopf. And comments saying how lots of US military personnel have Nazi-adjacent tattoos but it’s totally fine.
Who cares? He got it in his early 20ss. I’m sure at some point he later figured out the connection, or someone pointed it out to him. There was probably a several year delay before he went from “yeah, I suppose this does look a bit like that Nazi symbol, but I know I didn’t get it for Nazi purposes, so I don’t care” to “shit. I’m running for office. I’m seeking to be a role model. Best to cover that shit up before I put myself out in the limelight. It’s a bad example to send to children.” Self-discovery takes time.
I’m not looking to smear leftists though, so I don’t see what the big deal is.
If you can’t believe that a person can change, what hope can you have that societies can?
Wow. So you’re saying that if you inadvertently got a Nazi tattoo (which is already being generous btw), and then found out later that you had a huge SS tattoo on your chest, your reaction would just be “oh lol that’s a bummer” and go on with your life and not get it covered? Cause I’d be pretty fucking horrified.
When confronted with his obvious moral failings over the years, Planter’s defenders say “he’s changed, he wants to be a better person.” To which i say, has he really shown accountability for any of this?
He to this day he denies knowing he had a Nazi tattoo up until he was publicly called out on it, despite clear evidence to the contrary. He denies allegations of misconduct against his past girlfriends. I don’t think he’s even been open about cheating on his partner with like 14 different women just said something vague like “I wasn’t a good partner cause I had PTSD”
I believe people have the power to change but this guy feels like just another greasy politician to me, and I dont believe he has genuine remorse if he’s not even willing to admit to this stuff.
Wow. So you’re saying that if you inadvertently got a Nazi tattoo (which is already being generous btw), and then found out later that you had a huge SS tattoo on your chest, your reaction would just be “oh lol that’s a bummer” and go on with your life and not get it covered? Cause I’d be pretty fucking horrified.
Honestly, yes. I would react just that way. If I knew I didn’t get it as a Nazi symbol, and I realize that 99% of the population doesn’t recognize it as a Nazi symbol? Then yeah, I would be in no hurry to get rid of it. The Nazis had tons of symbols. We can’t just let them delete whole swathes of our culture. It’s OK to let go of the most blatant ones, like the swastika. I’m not going to try and redeem that. But the swastika is also the Nazi’s most well known symbol. Any prior association has been completely washed out by this. But a deaths head? That’s not a a Nazi symbol. That’s a pirate flag Nazis decided to appropriate.
If I got a tattoo that I thought was cool, but later found out it was also co-opted by some group of Nazis in a minor way? No. I’m not going to be in a rush to remove that. I refuse to let Nazis control my life. As long as the vast majority of the population doesn’t see it as a Nazi symbol, and I know in my heart I don’t mean it as a Nazi symbol? I’m not going to be in any rush to remove it.
Imagine if I was old enough to say, have a wedding anniversary or other important event in 1988, and, before knowing the neo-Nazi implication, got a tattoo that said “88.” If I later learned about the implications of that number, unless that tattoo was in a highly visible location, I wouldn’t remove it. I’m not publicly advertising the 88 by showing it off. The only people who ever see it are those close enough to me to know I’m not a Nazi. No. I see no reason to remove that. But maybe if I was going into public office, I would then remove it so that I wasn’t placing that symbol in the limelight.
Or, we can stop with this childish gotcha bullshit. Unless Platner has actually advocated Nazi policies, then STFU. Having poor symbolism doesn’t make you a Nazi. Believing in Nazi ideals, Nazi policies, and trying to enact them makes you a Nazi.
I can see why he took his time because honestly, it’s not that big a deal. I would have no problem hanging out with someone who had a such a tattoo. Hell, I wouldn’t view it as disqualifying to date someone with such a tattoo (if I weren’t already married.)
Again, it’s a pirate flag tattoo. That’s almost certainly what he was thinking of when he got it, and what it meant in his mind.
I’m sure his thought process was something like, “yeah, that pirate tattoo I got as a kid does unfortunately resemble the one the Nazis used. Everyone I know close enough to actually see the tattoo knows I’m not a Nazi, but as I’m entering politics, I better get it covered up before the hyperventilating morons on the internet use it as an excuse to slander me as a Nazi.”
In fact, I think you need to delete your lemmy username. Why? Because your name included “de Sol.” The Sun. You know what a major Nazi was? That’s right, the Black Sun!
The Nazis used solar iconography. Your account references the Sun. Therefore, you are a Nazi. Please delete your lemmy account, Nazi scum.
That’s so disingenuous. If I had a “black sun” tattoo, yeah that’s a pretty damn good sign im a Nazi or at least a Nazi sympathizer or edge lord. There’s a huge difference between that and regular sun imagery. You’re making it sound like Platner had a generic jolly Roger or skull and crossbones tattoo, when his design was clearly a skull and crossbones based off of the totenkopf. It doesnt just happen to resemble a totenkopf thats literally what it is. It is NOT a pirate tattoo, no more so than a tattoo of an eagle holding a swastika is an Indian good-luck symbol. Sure you can trace its roots back to something more innocent but that doesn’t make it innocent.
He had it on his chest for like 2 decades before getting it covered up. The only reason he got it covered up is because when he ran for office people called him out on it, but based on his comments on Reddit about totenkopfs and Nazi tattoos in the US military he clearly knew what it was long before the public outcry and did nothing (and in my opinion he probably knew what it was when he got it).
“Integrity is doing the right thing when nobody is watching”
I didn’t when I saw the tattoo and I didn’t recognize it as being the same as the one in from the That Mitchell and Webb Look skit, either. You must have an incredible eye for detail and amazing memory that you recognized the Nazi tattoo and were able to also recall it matched the symbol on a hat ypu saw in a sketch show.
Or maybe you’re trying too hard.
Dude got what he thought was a cool looking tattoo, not knowing the Nazi reference. What’s the other evidence you’re using to judge him here?
I wasn’t judging him, I’m saying people know that symbol as a symbol that Nazis used. Perhaps I recognize it because my dad watched WWII films/documentary as a kid.
If I’m suppose to judge him then his job working for Blackwater doesn’t paint the best picture of an individuals morals. I’m happy that he won, but his past is strange for a progressive.
The claim that WoodScientist is trying to argue is not just that he didn’t know what it meant when he got it (and that it’s fine he left it after learning about it), but also that anyone criticizing the tattoo must be disingenuous, because nobody knew what the symbol was before this controversy. In fact, lots of people knew what it was, some from that sketch, some from movies and stuff, some from keeping an eye on far-right groups, etc. If anything, the only thing I’m learning about from this controversy is just how many people don’t recognize it.
I still see it as a just a pirate symbol. I’m 90% certain you wouldn’t have been able to recognize it as a Nazi symbol in a line up of other deaths head symbols before this campaign started. Here it is:
To me this is just a pirate flag. Do you also call everyone that owns a dog a Nazi, because Hitler owned a dog?
Holy mental gymnastics, batman. He was a fighter, a WWII buff, a marine, a mercenary, who bragged about “fun wars”, and got a Nazi tattoo in a former Nazi-aligned state, and beyond universal healthcare, he really isn’t even terribly progressive or radical. If the boot fits…
This bizarre type of simping for milquetoast, neoliberal, suspicious candidates is how y’all keep ending up with the likes of Hillary and Biden - who inevitably cede their power to increasingly right-leaning candidates. This refusal to demand better for the Democrats (and further, admonishing those that do) is how we keep diving deeper into the fascist decay.
The simping is crazy. All the evidence points to a questionable past and when its brought up, people attack that individual instead. Its rather bizarre.
I hope Platner does a good job. If he ends up making questionable political choices moving forward though there would then shrug.
He was a fighter, a WWII buff, a marine, a mercenary, who bragged about “fun wars”, and got a Nazi tattoo in a former Nazi-aligned state, and beyond universal healthcare, he really isn’t even terribly progressive or radical. If the boot fits…
So he sounds like basically every soldier I’ve ever met? And quit slandering him with the Nazi label. You’re insulting the victims of the Holocaust every time you water down that term.
Platner is not a neoliberal. He defeated a neoliberal in the primary, running on an unabashadly progressive ticket. Demanding better Democrats is exactly why we now have Platner.
Your attitude is precisely why we’ve been stuck with such milquetoast candidates. Your approach selects for psychopathy. You demand candidates have perfectly manicured pasts. You only accept people with spotlessly clean backgrounds with nothing you find uncomfortable or problematic. The only people with those backgrounds are power-hungry psychopaths who’ve been groomed their entire lives for paths of power. You’re looking for wealthy white people who went to private school, did debate club in high school, and attended an Ivy League school. That’s the only kind of candidate you find acceptable - highly polished, a perfectly curated social media history, absolutely nothing objectionable about them.
That’s how you end up with soulless corporate goons. You end up with people that ultimately believe in nothing except achieving power, and they’ve lived their entire lives ensuring that they do absolutely nothing that could ever offend someone. You’re looking for candidates that have spent more time obsessing over their image than actually living their lives.
Sorry, but real people make mistakes. Real people have flaws. And if the Democratic Party is going to have any future, it needs to stop crucifying every male candidate that doesn’t have the vibe of a Harvard gender studies major.
A likely scenario is that a bunch of guys on leave gets drunk and everybody gets tattoos, and he drunkenly chooses this one because it looks wicked cool when you’re drunk. Perhaps they all got the same tattoo, and someone else picked it out.
Who knows? It’s all speculation, including that it’s proof that he’s an enthusiastic Nazi, but hiding it to fool the Libz. In fact, the drunken shore leave story makes more sense than being a Manchurian Candidate.
I’m a lifelong unaffiliated independent, and all I know is that I want the Dems to take the Senate majority, and Platner is key to that. I’d rather have a Dem Senate with Platner in it, than a MAGA Senate without him.
Plus they were in Croatia so I imagine there was a language barrier and it was 2007. The year the iPhone launched, so I highly doubt any of them had access to the internet the moment they got the tattoo. If one of the group did, I highly doubt they would have thought “hold on let me research all possible Nazi symbols before we get this skull tat”
Seriously. This is downright tame as far as military tattoos go. A 23 year marine was drunk with his buddies and thought a pirate tattoo would look pretty badass. And honestly? If it weren’t for the Nazi connotations, I would say it is pretty badass.
I swear, some people won’t be happy with a male progressive candidate unless they have the sanitized and castrated vibe of a gender studies major.
Right on. James Talarico is the perfect example of what you’re talking about. His image is so sanitized and insipid specifically to appeal to the milquetoast voter.
Controversies like this one only have staying power not because most reasonable people actually think it’s a problem, but because opposing campaigns and political parties astroturf social media and “strategically amplify” the story on mainstream news sources to make it seem that way.
What actual Nazi things has he done? Not just get a pirate flag tattoo. Like, what neo Nazi groups has he been a member of? What Nazi policies has he advocated for? Make your actual case. Don’t focus on bullshit gotcha crap.
Having looked at his old tattoo side-by-side with the totenkopf symbol they say it portrays I barely see the resemblance -it was more of a silhouette anyways. -That said, he’s since gotten that tattoo covered up with something less divisive.
There is none beyond, “vote blue no matter who,” which is super ironic since it’s coming from the people who always use that phrase as a cudgel against self-avowed leftists who vote Democrat in general elections to minimize harm.
I really hope the guy isn’t a fucking Nazi, and I would vote for him if I was a Maine voter… But that doesn’t mean I’m going to pretend it’s not a MAJOR red flag like people here seem wont to do
He’s not a perfect candidate, and Dems have to learn to let go of their weird obsession with perfection. The objective isn’t to elect the perfect candidate, it’s to elect a winning candidate.
This. I mean come on! People bitch about Fetterman turning right. But this guy has changed, he’s not a plant by the right at all. They won’t even entertain the possibility.
Fetterman had a stroke, which has been shown to change peoples’ personalities. Fetterman was also an establishment democrat even before running for senate. The fact that fettermans stroke was not enough to get the dems to replace him really makes their judgment of any candidate ring pretty fucking hollow, doesn’t it?
I feel like this is a really big point nobody brings up when this incessant and obnoxious non-sequitur pops up.
Fetterman’s value is in being one more seat closer to a Dem majority. He may not be a very cooperative member, he may even be a DINO, but he’s still a Democrat, and he makes it much easier for Dems to take the House majority. Let’s not forget that if Fetterman hadn’t won, we’d be stuck with Oz.
I’m sick of Dems having DINOs like Manchin and Sinema, but at least they register as Dems (Sinema eventually went Indy, but she was a Dem at the start), so they offer that tiny, but significant advantage.
It’s small consolation, but if we end up with a one vote lead in the Senate, we’ll see the value of a Fetterman or Platner. There’s a D next to their name, that’s good enough right now.
And if I couldn’t force myself to vote for Platner, I STILL wouldn’t vote for Collins. There is no scenario where I’m casting a vote for any MAGA Traitor Pedophile.
Wolf in wolves clothing? Do we have another Feterman? Why can’t we find someone a little less tarnished is all people are asking and everyone gets brigaded.
Fetterman had a stroke, which has been shown to change peoples’ personalities. Fetterman was also an establishment democrat even before running for senate. The fact that fettermans stroke was not enough to get the dems to replace him really makes their judgment of any candidate ring pretty fucking hollow, doesn’t it?
I feel like this is a really big point nobody brings up when this incessant and obnoxious non-sequitur pops up.
If you’re looking for perfect people to run for office you’re going to be waiting a long goddamn time. Personally, I’d rather somebody who’s a little bit tarnished and is publicly regretful of their past mistakes then someone who pretends to be the perfect person.
Susan Collins was like that. She pretended to be perfect. She pretended that she was going to work with both sides and then immediately fucked over the left. Kyrsten Sinema, she tried to convince everyone she was the perfect candidate and as soon as she got in office she switched sides and became basically Republican.
So yeah I’ll take somebody with a little tarnish and life lessons that taught them up how fucked up the other side actually is.
Unfortunately I am stuck here in Illinois, having had Dick Durbin as our senator for fucking decades. He’s only now being replaced because he’s voluntarily stepping down.
But but but he was a bad boyfriend in 2012 after 5 tours as a marine. Not abusive but a “bad” boyfriend
According to the woman who founded Ladies for Kavanaugh
According to the woman who founded Ladies for Kavanaugh
What’s your excuse for the Nazi tattoo
Have you met an Average American? Many don’t even know the history of the confederate flag and you expect them to know a nazi symbol not shown in popular media?
When did he get it? If at 21 he was young and stupid, if at 31 it’s a different story. Maybe you never was young and stupid, most people were.
Everything is a nazi/white supremacy/fascist symbol because nazis/white supremacists/fascists appropriate EVERYTHING. Every symbol they have they stole from someone else because they are lazy assholes and because they have to constantly change the code signals. Normies can’t, and honestly don’t want to, keep up with every frog skull lightning bolt mustache cartoon character hand signal bullshit icon they use to identify each other. Expecting people to feel bad or jump through hoops when it’s revealed that the nazis have “claimed” yet another thing we didn’t know they were using gives them power they don’t deserve.
This excuse stops working when somebody admits that the association IS THE CAUSE of their choice
True. But have you ever seen a white supremacist stop at one small ambiguous tattoo? Nazis usually are loudly obnoxious wildly unoriginal twats about their shittyness. They usually hang out with other nazis. They usually join nazis clubs. Where’s that oppo research? It all feels too corpo setup to me.
Here is the actual symbol.
If you had asked me what that symbol was before this campaign, I would have just said a pirate symbol. The only people with obsessive knowledge of SS iconography are WW2 buffs, neonazis, and neonazi WW2 buffs.
If you gave the average person a quiz, asking people to pick out nazi iconography from other uses of that imagery such as pirate flags. Most would fail that quiz. You likely would as well.
I’m sorry, but the “Nazi tattoo” thing is bullshit. A kid got a pirate flag tattoo, later found it was problematic, and covered it up. And bottom feeders like you use that as justification to slander him, even though there is no allegation he has ever been involved in any neo Nazi or similar movements ever before. I think you may be the actual Nazi here.
Ehm, cough, cough, …, this is the sign of the 3rd SS Panzer Division. So, yep, it is related to the Third Reich and hence to the Nazi regime.
This is an invalid argument because it pretends dogwhistles aren’t real, it pretends the intent is irrelevant of other interpretations exists.
HE KNEW THE ASSOCIATION AND KEPT IT
And those of us who are high enough on their lists to spend five minutes learning to identify common symbols that indicate danger.
Seriously? This is the worst thing about y’all. You simply won’t allow for the possibility that criticism is even genuine, let alone legitimate. Every single time someone raises a potential concern, it’s always, “You’re the real Nazi!” or “You’re a DNC bot!” or whatnot. As if there isn’t a single person on the planet who gets worried when a guy with a Nazi tattoo and a history as a mercenary is running for office.
You can argue that Platner is a lesser evil or whatever, but this, “If you have a problem with a totenkopf tattoo, you’re the real Nazi” shit is just straight up cult behavior.
I belong to exactly none of these groups but I know the obvious Nazi symbols because I don’t want Nazis around me or the people I love. Fuck off with the obvious fallacies.
It’s only an “obvious Nazi symbol” because you’ve chosen to call it that to slander Platner.
Before this campaign, you wouldn’t have been able to pick it out from a line up of pirate flags. You’re full of it.
No sir, I don’t give a fuck about Platner, I call them obvious Nazi symbols because it’s literally what comes up in the first image when you Google “obvious Nazi symbols”, you fucking doofus.
Googled it. Checks out.
Nah that’s such a cope. First of all he IS a WW2 buff. Second it’s fairly common knowledge that the SS used the skull and crossbones symbol. So if you’re getting a skull and crossbones tattoo in CROATIA, literally an Axis nation with a strong Neo-Nazi movement, maybe you should have your guard up?
Oh, and then there’s the part where he has reddit comments prior to being called out on his tattoo literally talking about the totenkopf. And comments saying how lots of US military personnel have Nazi-adjacent tattoos but it’s totally fine.
I know about how much alcohol was involved with combat marines in foreign ports and let me tell you, its a miracle that he remembers getting the tattoo in the first place, let alone getting it for some sort of deep seated ideological reason.
My first association of skull and crossbones isn’t Nazis. It’s pirates. When I think of Nazis, I think of the Swastika. That’s at least distinctive enough that it can be relegated to a Nazi symbol. But I’m sorry, I’m not letting the Nazis own the skull and cross bones. I’ll fly that flag high as a symbol of piracy and rebellion. I see nothing wrong with getting a skull and cross bones tattoo even today. I’m not letting the Nazis steal our culture from us.
Who cares? He got it in his early 20ss. I’m sure at some point he later figured out the connection, or someone pointed it out to him. There was probably a several year delay before he went from “yeah, I suppose this does look a bit like that Nazi symbol, but I know I didn’t get it for Nazi purposes, so I don’t care” to “shit. I’m running for office. I’m seeking to be a role model. Best to cover that shit up before I put myself out in the limelight. It’s a bad example to send to children.” Self-discovery takes time.
I’m not looking to smear leftists though, so I don’t see what the big deal is.
If you can’t believe that a person can change, what hope can you have that societies can?
Wow. So you’re saying that if you inadvertently got a Nazi tattoo (which is already being generous btw), and then found out later that you had a huge SS tattoo on your chest, your reaction would just be “oh lol that’s a bummer” and go on with your life and not get it covered? Cause I’d be pretty fucking horrified.
When confronted with his obvious moral failings over the years, Planter’s defenders say “he’s changed, he wants to be a better person.” To which i say, has he really shown accountability for any of this?
He to this day he denies knowing he had a Nazi tattoo up until he was publicly called out on it, despite clear evidence to the contrary. He denies allegations of misconduct against his past girlfriends. I don’t think he’s even been open about cheating on his partner with like 14 different women just said something vague like “I wasn’t a good partner cause I had PTSD”
I believe people have the power to change but this guy feels like just another greasy politician to me, and I dont believe he has genuine remorse if he’s not even willing to admit to this stuff.
Honestly, yes. I would react just that way. If I knew I didn’t get it as a Nazi symbol, and I realize that 99% of the population doesn’t recognize it as a Nazi symbol? Then yeah, I would be in no hurry to get rid of it. The Nazis had tons of symbols. We can’t just let them delete whole swathes of our culture. It’s OK to let go of the most blatant ones, like the swastika. I’m not going to try and redeem that. But the swastika is also the Nazi’s most well known symbol. Any prior association has been completely washed out by this. But a deaths head? That’s not a a Nazi symbol. That’s a pirate flag Nazis decided to appropriate.
If I got a tattoo that I thought was cool, but later found out it was also co-opted by some group of Nazis in a minor way? No. I’m not going to be in a rush to remove that. I refuse to let Nazis control my life. As long as the vast majority of the population doesn’t see it as a Nazi symbol, and I know in my heart I don’t mean it as a Nazi symbol? I’m not going to be in any rush to remove it.
Imagine if I was old enough to say, have a wedding anniversary or other important event in 1988, and, before knowing the neo-Nazi implication, got a tattoo that said “88.” If I later learned about the implications of that number, unless that tattoo was in a highly visible location, I wouldn’t remove it. I’m not publicly advertising the 88 by showing it off. The only people who ever see it are those close enough to me to know I’m not a Nazi. No. I see no reason to remove that. But maybe if I was going into public office, I would then remove it so that I wasn’t placing that symbol in the limelight.
Or, we can stop with this childish gotcha bullshit. Unless Platner has actually advocated Nazi policies, then STFU. Having poor symbolism doesn’t make you a Nazi. Believing in Nazi ideals, Nazi policies, and trying to enact them makes you a Nazi.
I can see why he took his time because honestly, it’s not that big a deal. I would have no problem hanging out with someone who had a such a tattoo. Hell, I wouldn’t view it as disqualifying to date someone with such a tattoo (if I weren’t already married.)
Again, it’s a pirate flag tattoo. That’s almost certainly what he was thinking of when he got it, and what it meant in his mind.
I’m sure his thought process was something like, “yeah, that pirate tattoo I got as a kid does unfortunately resemble the one the Nazis used. Everyone I know close enough to actually see the tattoo knows I’m not a Nazi, but as I’m entering politics, I better get it covered up before the hyperventilating morons on the internet use it as an excuse to slander me as a Nazi.”
In fact, I think you need to delete your lemmy username. Why? Because your name included “de Sol.” The Sun. You know what a major Nazi was? That’s right, the Black Sun!
The Nazis used solar iconography. Your account references the Sun. Therefore, you are a Nazi. Please delete your lemmy account, Nazi scum.
That’s so disingenuous. If I had a “black sun” tattoo, yeah that’s a pretty damn good sign im a Nazi or at least a Nazi sympathizer or edge lord. There’s a huge difference between that and regular sun imagery. You’re making it sound like Platner had a generic jolly Roger or skull and crossbones tattoo, when his design was clearly a skull and crossbones based off of the totenkopf. It doesnt just happen to resemble a totenkopf thats literally what it is. It is NOT a pirate tattoo, no more so than a tattoo of an eagle holding a swastika is an Indian good-luck symbol. Sure you can trace its roots back to something more innocent but that doesn’t make it innocent.
Lol, at least get the facts right. He didn’t say oh well, he learned and got a cover up tattoo
He had it on his chest for like 2 decades before getting it covered up. The only reason he got it covered up is because when he ran for office people called him out on it, but based on his comments on Reddit about totenkopfs and Nazi tattoos in the US military he clearly knew what it was long before the public outcry and did nothing (and in my opinion he probably knew what it was when he got it).
“Integrity is doing the right thing when nobody is watching”
Legitimately do you have any source for the claim he talked about the totenkopf on reddit before running.
In all the discourse I’ve heard on this, this is the first time I’ve seen that brought up
Its the symbol used on that " are we the baddies?" Skit, people recognize it as a Nazi symbol in pop culture.
I didn’t when I saw the tattoo and I didn’t recognize it as being the same as the one in from the That Mitchell and Webb Look skit, either. You must have an incredible eye for detail and amazing memory that you recognized the Nazi tattoo and were able to also recall it matched the symbol on a hat ypu saw in a sketch show.
Or maybe you’re trying too hard.
Dude got what he thought was a cool looking tattoo, not knowing the Nazi reference. What’s the other evidence you’re using to judge him here?
I wasn’t judging him, I’m saying people know that symbol as a symbol that Nazis used. Perhaps I recognize it because my dad watched WWII films/documentary as a kid.
If I’m suppose to judge him then his job working for Blackwater doesn’t paint the best picture of an individuals morals. I’m happy that he won, but his past is strange for a progressive.
That came out roughly 1 year before he got the tattoo.
How many British comedies do you think a deployed Marine was watching?
The claim that WoodScientist is trying to argue is not just that he didn’t know what it meant when he got it (and that it’s fine he left it after learning about it), but also that anyone criticizing the tattoo must be disingenuous, because nobody knew what the symbol was before this controversy. In fact, lots of people knew what it was, some from that sketch, some from movies and stuff, some from keeping an eye on far-right groups, etc. If anything, the only thing I’m learning about from this controversy is just how many people don’t recognize it.
I still see it as a just a pirate symbol. I’m 90% certain you wouldn’t have been able to recognize it as a Nazi symbol in a line up of other deaths head symbols before this campaign started. Here it is:
To me this is just a pirate flag. Do you also call everyone that owns a dog a Nazi, because Hitler owned a dog?
Holy mental gymnastics, batman. He was a fighter, a WWII buff, a marine, a mercenary, who bragged about “fun wars”, and got a Nazi tattoo in a former Nazi-aligned state, and beyond universal healthcare, he really isn’t even terribly progressive or radical. If the boot fits…
This bizarre type of simping for milquetoast, neoliberal, suspicious candidates is how y’all keep ending up with the likes of Hillary and Biden - who inevitably cede their power to increasingly right-leaning candidates. This refusal to demand better for the Democrats (and further, admonishing those that do) is how we keep diving deeper into the fascist decay.
The simping is crazy. All the evidence points to a questionable past and when its brought up, people attack that individual instead. Its rather bizarre.
I hope Platner does a good job. If he ends up making questionable political choices moving forward though there would then shrug.
So he sounds like basically every soldier I’ve ever met? And quit slandering him with the Nazi label. You’re insulting the victims of the Holocaust every time you water down that term.
Platner is not a neoliberal. He defeated a neoliberal in the primary, running on an unabashadly progressive ticket. Demanding better Democrats is exactly why we now have Platner.
Your attitude is precisely why we’ve been stuck with such milquetoast candidates. Your approach selects for psychopathy. You demand candidates have perfectly manicured pasts. You only accept people with spotlessly clean backgrounds with nothing you find uncomfortable or problematic. The only people with those backgrounds are power-hungry psychopaths who’ve been groomed their entire lives for paths of power. You’re looking for wealthy white people who went to private school, did debate club in high school, and attended an Ivy League school. That’s the only kind of candidate you find acceptable - highly polished, a perfectly curated social media history, absolutely nothing objectionable about them.
That’s how you end up with soulless corporate goons. You end up with people that ultimately believe in nothing except achieving power, and they’ve lived their entire lives ensuring that they do absolutely nothing that could ever offend someone. You’re looking for candidates that have spent more time obsessing over their image than actually living their lives.
Sorry, but real people make mistakes. Real people have flaws. And if the Democratic Party is going to have any future, it needs to stop crucifying every male candidate that doesn’t have the vibe of a Harvard gender studies major.
Why is Collins accepting money from actual Nazis?
Why do you think I defend Collins? Why are you that my very obvious point that YOU HAD BETTER CHOICES AVAILABLE isn’t the point?
Because the PR campaign that made up the story about the Nazi tattoo started in her office.
A likely scenario is that a bunch of guys on leave gets drunk and everybody gets tattoos, and he drunkenly chooses this one because it looks wicked cool when you’re drunk. Perhaps they all got the same tattoo, and someone else picked it out.
Who knows? It’s all speculation, including that it’s proof that he’s an enthusiastic Nazi, but hiding it to fool the Libz. In fact, the drunken shore leave story makes more sense than being a Manchurian Candidate.
I’m a lifelong unaffiliated independent, and all I know is that I want the Dems to take the Senate majority, and Platner is key to that. I’d rather have a Dem Senate with Platner in it, than a MAGA Senate without him.
Plus they were in Croatia so I imagine there was a language barrier and it was 2007. The year the iPhone launched, so I highly doubt any of them had access to the internet the moment they got the tattoo. If one of the group did, I highly doubt they would have thought “hold on let me research all possible Nazi symbols before we get this skull tat”
A friend of mine came back from the navy with a tattoo of 2 inch high old english block letters:
CHICKEN
POT PIE
Military on leave get some bad judgement tattoos all the time.
Seriously. This is downright tame as far as military tattoos go. A 23 year marine was drunk with his buddies and thought a pirate tattoo would look pretty badass. And honestly? If it weren’t for the Nazi connotations, I would say it is pretty badass.
I swear, some people won’t be happy with a male progressive candidate unless they have the sanitized and castrated vibe of a gender studies major.
Right on. James Talarico is the perfect example of what you’re talking about. His image is so sanitized and insipid specifically to appeal to the milquetoast voter.
Controversies like this one only have staying power not because most reasonable people actually think it’s a problem, but because opposing campaigns and political parties astroturf social media and “strategically amplify” the story on mainstream news sources to make it seem that way.
Can confirm that drunken sailors will get dumb tattoos. I used to work with a veteran who drunkenly got the Laughing Cow mascot tattooed on his thigh.
Then you fucking remove it when you learn what it is
He got it covered up last year.
You people do dumb shit? Especially as a marine.
Fuck, I did some dumb shit as a late teen/early 20’s that may have got me a a ‘watch list’ for flying
Well I didn’t do Nazi level dumb shit
What actual Nazi things has he done? Not just get a pirate flag tattoo. Like, what neo Nazi groups has he been a member of? What Nazi policies has he advocated for? Make your actual case. Don’t focus on bullshit gotcha crap.
OK so you’re arguing that he’s an idiot for getting a Nazi tattoo then.
Being that stupid is also disqualifying
Yeah, maybe that’s something that should disqualify someone from office. Call me crazy I guess.
Ok. You’re crazy.
So he can walk into the Pentagon and hang with the homies
Having looked at his old tattoo side-by-side with the totenkopf symbol they say it portrays I barely see the resemblance -it was more of a silhouette anyways. -That said, he’s since gotten that tattoo covered up with something less divisive.
“Meh”
There is none beyond, “vote blue no matter who,” which is super ironic since it’s coming from the people who always use that phrase as a cudgel against self-avowed leftists who vote Democrat in general elections to minimize harm.
I really hope the guy isn’t a fucking Nazi, and I would vote for him if I was a Maine voter… But that doesn’t mean I’m going to pretend it’s not a MAJOR red flag like people here seem wont to do
He’s not a perfect candidate, and Dems have to learn to let go of their weird obsession with perfection. The objective isn’t to elect the perfect candidate, it’s to elect a winning candidate.
This. I mean come on! People bitch about Fetterman turning right. But this guy has changed, he’s not a plant by the right at all. They won’t even entertain the possibility.
Okay. Hope they’re right.
Fetterman had a stroke, which has been shown to change peoples’ personalities. Fetterman was also an establishment democrat even before running for senate. The fact that fettermans stroke was not enough to get the dems to replace him really makes their judgment of any candidate ring pretty fucking hollow, doesn’t it?
I feel like this is a really big point nobody brings up when this incessant and obnoxious non-sequitur pops up.
I hope you get the person you vote for.
I hope you get that person too
Perfect is the worst enemy of good
Sound like maga.
Since you seem to be a US-American I’m not surprised you don’t know that saying
You really can’t see the similarities??
Fetterman’s value is in being one more seat closer to a Dem majority. He may not be a very cooperative member, he may even be a DINO, but he’s still a Democrat, and he makes it much easier for Dems to take the House majority. Let’s not forget that if Fetterman hadn’t won, we’d be stuck with Oz.
I’m sick of Dems having DINOs like Manchin and Sinema, but at least they register as Dems (Sinema eventually went Indy, but she was a Dem at the start), so they offer that tiny, but significant advantage.
It’s small consolation, but if we end up with a one vote lead in the Senate, we’ll see the value of a Fetterman or Platner. There’s a D next to their name, that’s good enough right now.
And if I couldn’t force myself to vote for Platner, I STILL wouldn’t vote for Collins. There is no scenario where I’m casting a vote for any MAGA Traitor Pedophile.
Wolf in wolves clothing? Do we have another Feterman? Why can’t we find someone a little less tarnished is all people are asking and everyone gets brigaded.
Fetterman had a stroke, which has been shown to change peoples’ personalities. Fetterman was also an establishment democrat even before running for senate. The fact that fettermans stroke was not enough to get the dems to replace him really makes their judgment of any candidate ring pretty fucking hollow, doesn’t it?
I feel like this is a really big point nobody brings up when this incessant and obnoxious non-sequitur pops up.
If you’re looking for perfect people to run for office you’re going to be waiting a long goddamn time. Personally, I’d rather somebody who’s a little bit tarnished and is publicly regretful of their past mistakes then someone who pretends to be the perfect person.
Susan Collins was like that. She pretended to be perfect. She pretended that she was going to work with both sides and then immediately fucked over the left. Kyrsten Sinema, she tried to convince everyone she was the perfect candidate and as soon as she got in office she switched sides and became basically Republican.
So yeah I’ll take somebody with a little tarnish and life lessons that taught them up how fucked up the other side actually is.
Unfortunately I am stuck here in Illinois, having had Dick Durbin as our senator for fucking decades. He’s only now being replaced because he’s voluntarily stepping down.