In short:
A live-stream broadcast of China’s military parade has captured Xi Jinping and Vladimir Putin discussing biotechnology’s potential to extend life.
An interpreter translating Mr Putin can be heard saying in Mandarin that human organ transplants could let “us live younger and younger, and perhaps even achieve immortality”.
Mr Xi responded that it may be possible for people to live to 150 years this century.
God they are so posturing to eachother. Small-egoed dictators.
too bad organ transplants dont make you bulletproof.
Gross. Absolutely gross. Powerful old people are already living too long.
I will happily help transplant their organs.
Damn. They gonna make me retire at 140 then. Shit.
Not without brain transplants
They will head transplant
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head_transplantArthur Caplan, a bioethicist, has written “Head transplants are fake news. Those who promote such claims and who would subject any human being to unproven cruel surgery merit not headlines but only contempt and condemnation.”[10]
I’m not sure if they will transplant head to another body or to the robot or just make a wolverine with artificial heart. China have it’s own rules.
https://interestingengineering.com/science/china-paralyzed-patients-walk-brain-spinal-implantIf that is really true, they can probably create many more cybernetic devices. Far as keeping dear leader alive that way they would need to keep secrecy of it tight enough that nobody would be aware of it until it was too late.
Oh is he doing experiments on Uyghur people
You know, its crazy how many times I’ve heard this rumor floated relative to the very real organ harvesting business that’s been happening in Israel since the 1990s
More than one country can be bad. Israel is very bad. China is also very bad.
I was going to say there was no actual evidence, but huh, I actually fell for some of the tankie lies after enough time. China’s deputy health minister Huang Jiefu repeatedly publicly acknowledged that most organ transplants came from death row inmates, and separately China was exporting organs to south korea on a massive scale prior to 2007.
(though it’s notable that this has not been connected to the Uyghur situation specifically)
(Also noting that it’s Israel claimed to end the practice in 2000, while China claimed to end the practice in 2015)
sources pre-emptively posted: the guardian, (old) beijing times, zhenhua.163.com, der spiegel
It is weird to point to a country that’s actively engaged in a holocaust and compare it to one that has eliminated poverty and boosted life expectancy by decades. One is slaughtering hundreds of thousands and the other is dramatically improving the lives of hundreds of millions.
You were the one that brough up the comparison in the first place.
I noted a real well-documented instance of organ harvesting, yes. I wasn’t just farting out speculations because I hate the country’s politics.
Look let’s ease of the Xi Jinping dicksucking. The CCP is an objectively oppressive regime with a terrifying human rights track record. All the tankie whataboutism in the world isn’t going to change that.
It is difficult for me to imagine what “personal liberty” is enjoyed by an unemployed person, who goes about hungry, and cannot find employment. Real liberty can exist only where exploitation has been abolished, where there is no oppression of some by others, where there is no unemployment and poverty, where a man is not haunted by the fear of being tomorrow deprived of work, of home and of bread. Only in such a society is real, and not paper, personal and every other liberty possible.
So it’s likely
Probably not
Probably*
Okay, just because you think can live that long physically doesn’t mean you’ll be there mentally. You can do all these transplants to keep your body going, but I don’t think we’ve figured out how to replace the brain without killing someone since I doubt healthy living and organ transplants are gonna keep the brain healthy enough to be mentally fit to do much of anything.
Also, I personally wouldn’t want people like them to be living that long.
What makes you think they are all there mentally now?
I don’t. They’re crazy, but crazy only gets crazier with age.
Apart from the fact that your brain ages too and it’s 100% irreplaceable, the main issue with turning yourself into the human Ship of Theseus is that you’re going to be on immunosuppressant drugs forever.
I guess if you were a monster you could raise clones of yourself to adulthood and then murder them for their body parts. This doesn’t solve the problem of some parts not being reasonably replaceable, but it could protect you from some organ failures.
Apart from the fact that your brain ages too and it’s 100% irreplaceable
Braincells are irreplaceable (barring some experimental stem cell work) but the networks between those brain cells keep growing and intertwining. It’s the network between the cells that defines your mental aptitude. Plenty of stories about people with severe brain damage who still continue to function comparatively normally after a period of recovery and rehabilitation. The human brain is remarkably plastic.
I guess if you were a monster you could raise clones of yourself to adulthood and then murder them for their body parts.
Even that isn’t strictly practical. The failure rate on cloning is enormous. What’s legit more monstrous than killing someone for organs is producing all of the failed clones necessary to land on a copy that’s viable.
Dolly the Sheep was a “successful” clone, and even it didn’t live a particularly long or happy life, being euthanized at half the normal age of a domesticated sheep of her breed due to arthritis and lung disease.
No doubt someone is out there doing human cloning illegally. But I would not bank on it as a viable alternative to simply getting bumped up the organ donor list the old fashioned way.
I think if ALL, literally ALL of your other organs were functioning great, then it is unlikely your brain will deterioriate by itself randomly. Your body is constantly repairing itself, that’s why we are able to live so long.
But like, are they REALLY going to transplant things like the thymus? Can they even do that? Adrenal glands, parathyroid glands, thyroid, kidneys, livers, pancreas - idk man, I do not see these people getting all these organs replaced. That is an INSANE bodily experiment that has never truly been tested, let alone with lab grown organs (as Xi or Putin suggested), let alone in elderly and delicate subjects. We can’t even pull off natural looking facelifts in most subjects.
Adding in organs with different ages and donors also means they also may have increased loads on their remaining old aged organs too. Everything works together and donor organs can have a different circadian rhythm, let alone different genes which means different reactions to stimuli. Not to mention currently the most likely situation for organ transplant would be gene editing animal organs - again, experimental and never done on multiple organs. https://hms.harvard.edu/news/first-genetically-edited-pig-kidney-transplanted-human
Like managing multiple organ rejections in a 90yr old seeking immortality sounds like a joke of a case for any health care provider.
But please, someone convince both those men to get multiple organs transplanted ASAP
There are current studies about growing entire organs in a lab environment using 3D printed scaffolding and stem cells harvested from the patient, so the final product is 100% compatible and eliminates the need for immunosuppressants.
Still a few decades out for human testing imo but they’d be the first in line.
If we figure that out, artificial blood (which is already making good progress) and finally a way to regenerate brain cells without causing massive brain tumors we can extend life considerably, probably closer to 200 years on extreme cases.
Or, at least, making it to 110 while still having a good quality of life, basically making 100 the new 60.
Lol, lmfao
They can’t even give us a relatively nontoxic living environment and adaptive and responsive nutrition plans
Not to mention there has NEVER been a patient who has had MULTIPLE 3D printed organ transplants, let alone continuous transplants PRN (the suture sites are going to be dissolving scar tissue). And that 3D printed organs are extremely complicated especially depending on which one is being built, with their own cellular memory including circadian rhythm and local homeostasis.
Not to mention that merely transplanting an organ does not mean the patient will have adequate neurochemicals or enzymes or receptors to carry out the processes needed to support these organs, regardless of supplementation
Like certain conditions, at end of life, oppose each other especially in treatment. Eg congestive heart failure, pulmonary edema, and kidney failure all interfere and interact with each other. Assuming you could successfully perform a lung, heart, and kidney transplant in a geriatric patient, whose to say their veings, connective tissue, ureters, etc won’t prolapse or blow out from all the pressure and new stressers?
This shit isn’t as easy as they want to claim (maybe they want to taunt Trump with immortality), but if they want to be the guinea pigs for it, let them ig - that’s the most ethical thing they could do with this, is experiment on themselves and take the consequences.
Except that these psychos are definitely going to harvest organs from the so-called lesser races within their borders.
And then what, that’s even LESS likely to work out compared to 3D orinted organs or animal organs that have been gene edited. That’s what I’m saying, this is a pipe dream, they cannot harvest/transplant MULTIPLE organs with random people’s genes in them, place them in someone’s body and have it work out like replacing car parts. Multiple organ transplants like that are just not really done because of how many variables and issues come from each transplant. They can try to Frankenstein themselves as much as they want, but like all fascist delusional “science,” it is genuinely idiotic and done stupidly and badly.
Well, you suggested to let them do it. I’m suggesting that they will not hesitate to commit massive human rights violating, nonconsensual nazi experiments, so no we shouldn’t allow them.
The fact that it absolutely won’t work is secondary.
I’m not granting permission, I’m saying if we follow their logic and methods to its natural conclusions, they will die, eg giving a proof.
They cannot use other human organs, this is already a roadblock for them. If they could, they already would be doing so (see blood transfusions). I was talking about 3D printed organs, not organs from others.
You brought up organs from others. I then explained it is even MORE of an issue to attempt to transplant (hence why we developed other means). Your refusal to understand that does not mean you are correct that they will do this. You’re in fact wrong.
However, perhaps they want to eat these organs instead of transplant them, I’m not saying they won’t go after human bodies for various reasons, and obviously all genocide should be stopped.
But they aren’t going to do multiple organ transplants from other human to human donors in our lifetimes, if ever. If you understood transplants, you’d understand why that just isn’t a thing and won’t be a thing.
It’s as stupid as head transplants and Neuralink.
You want to go to the Island.
Was just about to say, “wasn’t this the plot of what I thought was a shitty scarjo flick from 10+ years ago”?
Ever read House of the Scorpion? It predicted this exact situation yeaaaaars ago, good read too
I honestly believe people could live to 150 within the next century and if organ transplants are part of it it will either be due to cloning or far better control of the immune system than we have now. I don’t expect those advances to be soon enough to help either of these guys, no matter how much money they have.
I honestly believe people could live to 150 within the next century
It’s a fun and easy thing to believe. Significantly harder to accomplish.
I don’t expect those advances to be soon enough to help either of these guys
They’ve already benefited substantively from the last 70 years of health technology. And I wouldn’t be surprised of Xi, in particular, is enjoying some knock-on effects of being the head of state in a nation that’s on the cutting edge of medical research.
But there’s a huge difference between “living to 100” and “being a functional adult at age 100”. Xi’s already pushing the line in his 70s and should have been queuing up a successor two terms ago. Putin’s in it even worse, having trotted out Medeved and watched him flop in front of Parliament back in… what? 2008? Now he’s got the tiger by the tail as he coasts into his own golden years.
The fact that the US is floundering amidst its own techno-fascist gerentocracy should be a giant alarm bell for every other national government. You can’t just stack the fate of your country on whether Chucks Grassley and Schumer can maintain a pulse indefinitely. But I guess when its your turn in the big chair, its easy to think you’ll live forever.
Life expectancy at 25 hasn’t changed dramatically in the last 2000 years, less than 10 years in most parts of the world. Life expectancy at birth has improved dramatically, and that isn’t doing much for me, Putin, or Xi at this point. Certainly, the improved healthcare afforded to Putin and Xi is going to help their life expectancy more than the average. All that said, a lot of improvements have happened in the last couple centuries, mostly based on our knowledge. Sure, exponential growth isn’t going to happen forever, not even in gaining knowledge, but I wouldn’t be surprised to see it happen in biology for the next century. If it does, extending life expectancy at birth to 150 could be quite conservative.
Life expectancy at 25 hasn’t changed dramatically in the last 2000 years
Heavily dependent on where and when you lived. In Tibet, for instance, life expectancy topped out at around 35 years in 1950 and is now cresting 75 in 2025. In the Palestinian Territories, the last ten years have seen life expectancy actually grew from 67 years to 76 years between 1992 and 2022. Then, in 2023, it fell off a cliff for some reason.
A nasty famine, a brutal war, or a global pandemic can clip the lives of senior citizens short very quickly.
But otherwise, sure. Solving the problems of agriculture and sanitation modernization have been comparatively easy relative to addressing telomere erosion or alzhemier’s treatments. Simply not killing people is a lot easier than keeping them alive indefinitely.
Although, one might also argue that the problems of aging haven’t been felt so acutely prior to the 1950s, because comparatively fewer people were living into their senior years. Now that we have a bumper crop of senior citizens, we’ve been given a strong economic incentive to pursue technologies at an industrial scale. It’s not just The Qin Emperor downing cups of mercury, thinking his exceptional wealth and privilege will grant him an extract century of youthfulness.
There is a difference between maximum age and life expectancy, just as there is a difference between life expectancy at different ages. The life expectancy at 25 in Roman times was about 70 years old. All of our advances have added about 10% to a person’s life span after they got past childhood diseases, the recklessness of youth, and serving in the military in the case of Romans. And I’m not entirely sure of the relevance of a genocide in Israel to Xi’s prospects.
It is very strange for how when I call for age limits on our politicians, that people say it is unfair or ageist. Honestly, I find that weird, because age and all the issues that comes with it, will find us.
A lot of people see the idea of age limits (or term limits) as a backdoor way of getting “their guy” off the ballot. Because so much of the modern political scene is just charismatic demagoguery, anything that threatens the position of your personal political Messiah is an attack on your ideological faith.
Better to elect some decrypt mummy leaking shit out of his adult diaper than risk some rival sect of the party taking office.
They have other sources for organs.
Immune suppression drugs have their own risks, and the older you are, the harder surgeries are on you. Even if they have cloned organs, how does that help systemic frailty?
I would expect nothing or much more than 150. You only live as long as the weakest links in your body. Solving one isn’t going to get ypu to 150. And if you solve enpugh to get to 150, you should live a lot longer.
And if you solve enpugh to get to 150, you should live a lot longer.
Really depends on how you solve it. Announcing “we can keep you in a vegetative state for an extra 50 years” isn’t a strong sign that the technology is there yet. Besides, there’s a lot more to living than just heartbeat and baseline brain activity.
I wasn’t setting an upper limit. There is good evidence we are closing in on some of the causes of the symptoms of aging, as well as gaining evidence that dealing with the symptoms may reduce the effects of aging. If we only have those basic tools in the next 100 years, I could see lifespans being pushed to 150 to 200 for the typical person. If we can also deal with the lesser regenerative capability of the brain, I could see people living for centuries. As you said in other comments, there are a lot of interconnected pieces, and just fixing one or some of them won’t be as useful as fixing all of them, which really takes transplants off the table as a general solution, but also means we may see limited increases in life span rather than getting past the tipping point of life extension research outpacing the gain it gives you, eg., extending lifespans more than one year per year.
There also is one thing I believe is still unknown. Why 115ish seems to be the upper limit. The ones who make it that long are often in relatively good health. But they still die (usually in thier sleep) anyway. With no real reason why. So we need to figure that out to break through the current line.
Bad simulation design?
That sounds like the average conversation of a group of guys on their 3rd beer on a Friday afternoon.
Yeah although these guys have access to an unlimited supply of freshly harvested organs which puts a different spin on it.
Pass the bong.
Or a bunch of morons who have completely lost touch with reality on account of having unchallenged absolute power for far too long.
What being rich and alienated from real people does to a MF.
You see the same thing with silicon valley ceos.
Who also think they’re going to be immortal.
Probably that’s because that’s exactly what this is? They’re watching a parade having a beer. What did we expect?
That’s what I’m trying to convey here
I hope they try it. At their age recovering from major surgery will be a breeze. I wish I was on immune suppressants for the rest of my life. Oh and don’t forget another surgery when the organ fails! Sounds like immortality to me
Even better, you know these guys love their Scotch. Lets see how long they can go without indulging after they get that new liver
You never know. Friend of mine had a liver transplant and was completely off the immunosuppressants in 18 months, never took 'em again.
In china, heart surgeon, number 1!..
Can you imagine the suffering of being an organ donor clone of one of these dictators? That’s some scifi level of hell.
There’s a fictional movie about it.
Honestly kind of idyllic. The premise of living in a childish Utopia until you’ve “won the lottery” seems far more generous on its face than the slaughterhouse conditions most domesticated animals endure.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_House_of_the_Scorpion
This is another take on the concept, really compelling read.
us as in literally “the two of us”. fucking hell, die already and stop leeching
