"If detonated, they would not damage the reactors but would create an image of shelling from the Ukrainian side,” the statement on Telegram said. It said the Ukrainian army stood “ready to act under any circumstances”.
In his nightly video message, Zelenskiy said Russia was planning to “simulate an attack” on the plant. “But in any case, the world sees – and cannot fail to see – that the only source of danger to the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant is Russia. And no one else.”
Zelenskiy and the Ukrainian military provided no evidence for their assertions"
"If detonated, they would not damage the reactors but would create an image of shelling from the Ukrainian side,” the statement on Telegram said.
Not gonna lie, that’s pretty smart. Now if Ukraine decides to start shelling the plant, they can just pretend that it’s actually Russia that detonated some charges.
I think that’s a pattern we’ll start seeing more and more.
EDIT: i removed this comment previously because lemmy hiccuped and registered the one about bridge selling twice.
And despite it being empty, it still recieved 23 downvotes.
This is how factual discussion with liberals is.
So, you said something dumb, and it’s everyone else’s fault? 🤣
Zelenskiy and the Ukrainian military provided no evidence for their assertions
Judging from the comments, he could probably finance that entire war just by selling bridges to liberals -_-
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What the fuck is this comment section?!
Russian copium brigade out for a special typing operation
How is the Russian propaganda attempting to frame that? “Ukrainians are Nazis and so we took over their nuclear power plant because we (though we) could. Now they want to destroy it, incurring an immense ecological impact to mostly themselves, because if they can’t have it, better be dead too”?
“turns out the ukranians actually liked chernobyl, so much so that they’re probably planning on doing it again!”
Don’t underestimate Russias stupidity and sheer incompetence, they probably think the brainwashed masses in russia will believe them. We need a hard line to stop it, but, if russia wants their face kicked in by NATO for real, who am I to deny them. I hope for a crater where the Kremlin stands.
I don’t think most of them believe the government media, they just go along with it. And the ones that are against it are already dead/in gulags/sent to Ukraine. That’s what totalitarian states do.
How is the Russian propaganda attempting to frame that?
Just see this comment section. “Ukranian artillery did it!”
Your guess is as good as mine. But if you have watched Russ TV, they aren’t afraid of saying the most ridiculous things.
Though according to the article: Renat Karchaa, an adviser to the head of Rosenergoatom, which operates Russia’s nuclear network, said Ukraine planned to drop ammunition laced with nuclear waste transported from another of the country’s five nuclear stations on the plant.
“Under cover of darkness overnight on 5 July the Ukrainian military will try to attack the Zaporizhzhia station using long-range precision equipment and kamikaze attack drones,” Russian news agencies quoted Karchaa as telling Russian television. He offered no evidence in support of the allegation."
Yes, but also “We need a status quo cease fire, clearly things are getting dangerous for everybody, let’s all sit down at the bargaining table right now. Of course, in the meantime we keep our current territory and that is the starting point for negotiation, not any territory you might get in the next few months.”
It’s calling timeout, no tag backs when you’re losing in tag. Or as putin calls it “escalate to de-escalate”.
How is the Russian propaganda attempting to frame a completely baseless claim without any evidence and that make no sense, is that seriously the question you’re asking here?
The Russians are not making it easy for themselves, aren’t they?
Ah yeah, that totally looks like a reliable site that somebody without any brain damage would use as a source.
I don’t need more evidence that your problem is with reading comprehension. This isn’t a news source per se, this tells what the Russian state media reports about. It doesn’t take much effort to corroborate that:
https://eurasiantimes.com/ukraine-suicide-drone-attacks-zaporizhzhia-nuclear-power/
Speaking about brain damage.
You haven’t collaborated anything, and the fact that you think that’s collaboration further underscores my point. How about we look at what IAEA, who actually have people on the ground, have to say
I think you should take a break, walk outside for a bit, and hop back with a clearer mind. Your are arguing about… I don’t know what about.
Fact: Russian newspapers are announcing that an attack by Ukraine on the ZNPP is imminent. It doesn’t matter whether you trust Ukraine’s account of it, because this is literally in the Russian newspapers: https://www.rt.com/russia/579215-ukrainian-attack-nuclear-plant/
My question is: (what THIS thread is about) from the viewpoint of a Russian propagandist, how can they make this story seem credible, (or, IOW, what would Ukraine’s motive be) considering that this would hurt Ukraine the most.
Next time you can use less of your condescending tone and more of your reading time to post on point.
I think you should take your own advice, also try working on your reading comprehension while you’re at it given that your link says Russia is worried that Ukraine would cause a provocation.
From a view point of a sane person who isn’t guzzling Ukrainian propaganda out of a firehouse, it’s pretty obvious that the Ukrainian offensive is a giant failure. Even western media now admits this. NATO summit is happening in a week, and Ukraine is desperate to get NATO involved directly in the conflict.
It’s also pretty clear that the puppet regime in Ukraine doesn’t care one bit about hurting their own country. If they did, they would’ve taken the peace agreement they were offered back in March.
These comments… I wasn’t expecting Lemmy to be russian bots just chatting with each other.
I mean, lemmy does have a sizable tankie population at lemmygrad
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I’m guilty of this as well, but perhaps it’s time to acknowledge that people can have differing opinions and be vocal about them without being bots or trolls.
I’m sorry for having behaved rude just because some people have a different take on this war. I mean, unless they’re as obvious as the government sponsored bullshit on Twitter where 3 accounts write the same crap in the same thread. 🌚
I’m also in no way a Putin fan.
Posts like this are useful as you can easily find trolls and bots to instantly block.
Has anyone seen the movie Universal Soldier?
yeah sure.
Budanov, Head of Ukrainian Intelligence, now reverses his stance and claims that the threat of “artificial catastrophe” at the ZNPP is “quietly decreasing”.
In other words, he called off the attack.
What changed?
https://en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/921266-amp.html
June 21-30: Ukraine ramped up rhetoric that Russia had plans to sabotage ZNPP.
July 1-4: Massive external scraping on Twitter causing Elon to limit user views.
July 6: Ukraine claims threat of ZNPP sabotage is no more.
Maybe Western Intelligence were using AI to scrape social media to gauge public perception of the ZNPP/Ukraine, to see if the public were buying their Russian sabotage psyop.
What they found was that the public logically pieced together that Ukraine/Deep State are the ones who benefit from the potential sabotage, as their goal is to convince NATO to takeover the war and drag the US directly into conflict with Russia, because the counter-offensive was a catastrophe and the Ukrainian military failed.
Nobody was buying Zelensky’s claims. Even the IAEA went out of their way to tell us that these claims of Russian-planted explosives were unverified.
Maybe Western Intelligence saw that the public were not buying their psyop attempt, and AI judged that they couldn’t successfully pull it off because the data they scraped showed that the public were too keen to their plot. Thus Budanov claiming the threat has magically disappeared.
In other words, maybe public awareness might have just prevented Chernobyl 2.0.
Regardless of if this is what actually happened or not, one thing is for certain; citizen journalists are dominating in the Information War right now. We are taking Western propaganda and dismantling it in quick succession. The enemy have lost their stranglehold on the narrative and thus public perception.
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The International Atomic Energy Agency (UN nuclear watchdog) has been monitoring the ZNPP for months, at the request of Russia.
Today, they report there is no evidence of planted explosives at the ZNPP.
Essentially, the UN said Zelensky is full of shit.
You do realise it was Russia who’s been shelling the ZNPP, and it was the Ukrainian staff keeping the plant safe?
So, No. Russia hasn’t asked for monitoring. It was the IAEE itself.
" The ZNPP has been controlled by Russian forces since early March. Over the past seven months, its Ukrainian operating staff have worked to prevent a nuclear accident during the current military conflict, in extremely difficult conditions with frequent shelling at the plant or near it."
Also the IAEE STILL hasn’t been granted full access by plant which has been under Russian military control.
" The IAEA experts have requested additional access that is necessary to confirm the absence of mines or explosives. In particular, access to the rooftops of reactor units 3 and 4 is essential, as well as access to parts of the turbine halls and some parts of the cooling system at the plant."
It’s incredible that a grown ass adult could be so gullible as to genuinely believe that Russia has been shelling a power plant they control and have stationed troops at. Western propagandists really don’t have to work hard because it’s clear that the public lacks basic reasoning skills.
From your link:
VIENNA, July 5 (Reuters) - Experts from the U.N. nuclear watchdog based at the Russian-held Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant in Ukraine have yet to observe any indications of mines or explosives at the plant, but they need more access to be sure
Hey now, let’s not let facts get in the way of a liberal circle jerk.
Russo bot
Imagine genuinely thinking that Russia blows up their own infrastructure for no reason. The fact that this is a serious topic of discussion in the west shows that any sort of critical thinking has been eradicated at this point.
Really? They also once had a hydroelectric dam. Just don’t post…
You mean the hydroelectric dam that even US admitted Ukraine was launching missiles against? Just don’t post…
All the hard work you put into spreading nonsense is wasted in Lemmy. There aren’t enough users to make it worthwhile. Then again, you’d be banned quickly somewhere like Reddit, so I guess it’s your only choice.
Watching empire shills trying to interact with people outside corporate walled gardens is pretty hilarious.
Are you watching me now, comrade? Prove it.
You’re not my comrade.
Yeah. They value their stuff so much. Particularly their own soldiers.
Sure more than Ukraine who’ve been throwing theirs into minefields. If they didn’t value their soldiers they’d be doing what Ukraine is currently doing. Instead, they spent the time building defences and training their troops.
It’s not their own territory
It’s literally territory they’ve annexed from Ukraine. And anybody who actually paid attention for the past month can see that Ukraine is in no position to take any territory back based on how their offensive is going.
No position to take any territory back? How about the 300km^2 they took back already this summer?
Oh you mean the territory Russia didn’t actually contest because they haven’t mobilized yet. Amazing counterpoint you’ve got there. 🤡
They have mobilized 300,000 troops last year. It’s news to Russia that they didn’t contest it, since they fought for and lost Pyatyhatky, just now fighting for and losing Zherebyanky.
There are intense battles in Orikhiv area, but that could go either way. If Russia loses anything “they are not even trying”?
Don’t engage. He is a useful idiot and very determined.
While you provide a fascinating arm chair analysis of the situation, why don’t we just look at what people who actually have a clue on the subject say
Why should I believe those people? Who made them experts?
Watch the actual developments on the ground, don’t listen to propaganda. Russian telegram channels tell you how the war is going, don’t need a guy to pretend to know the future
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As far as Russia is concerned, Zaporizhzhia is Russian territory and there is no chance of Ukraine actually recapturing it. Anybody who thinks that Russia would cause a major nuclear disaster on their own territory is beyond reason.
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Ok, so let’s say both sides think it’s their territory, so neither will want to cause a nuclear disaster there. That seems like a good balance for everyone else on this planet, for the time being.
The difference is that Ukraine is now entirely reliant on the west to continue fighting. This creates incentives for Ukraine to continuously seek escalation that could potentially get NATO directly involved in the conflict. Incidentally, US senators already introduced a resolution calling for NATO involvement in case of such an incident
Why is that?
Because that’s obvious to anybody who’s been paying any attention to what’s been going on for the past two years. This ultimately comes down to manpower and logistics. Ukraine has far less people than Russia, and the west lacks the industrial base to continue supplying Ukraine at the current levels. This is well documented in western media by the way.
This was also understood long before the war started. Here’s what Obama had to say back in 2016:
The reality of the situation is that the west gave Ukraine everything they could for this offensive, and it will not be possible to replace that in the near future. The offensive was supposed to make a decisive breakthrough in the first 24 hours. In fact, this was critical for any sort of success https://foreignpolicy.com/2023/04/18/ukraine-russia-war-counteroffensive-attack-bakhmut-himars/
It’s now been a month, and Ukraine has failed to reach even the first line of Russia defences while suffering horrific losses.
The offensive is going so poorly that even CNN calls it disappointing
https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/22/politics/ukraine-counteroffensive-western-assessment/index.html
The most likely outcome here is that Ukraine will burn through their men and equipment, and once the offensive fizzles it’s likely that Russia will go on the offensive of their own against a demoralized and depleted Ukrainian army.
John Mearsheimer has a pretty sober analysis of what can be expected to happen realistically that I highly encourage you to read
https://mearsheimer.substack.com/p/the-darkness-ahead-where-the-ukraine
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Ukraine is fighting an existential war because now that Russia has committed itself to military action they’re not going to settle for the status quo. Best case scenario for Ukraine at this point is that there’s going to be a rump state left in western Ukraine where nationalist sentiment is the strongest. Meanwhile, Vietnam is actually a good analogy, but with US deciding to drop support for western Ukraine once they realize the war is not winnable.
Russia has been making the same claims against Ukraine since at least november 2022 in front of the UN.
Such an attack would benefit Ukraine since it’s more likely to cause NATO to get involved. Don’t forget that.
NATO benefits the most in not getting directly involved. Don’t forget that.
Lol. You honestly think NATO countries wouldn’t check the story before comitting to an open conflict they don’t want to be in? That the people in all of Europe wouldn’t want to know who actually blew up the plant and spewed radioactivity over their lands? That everyone’s just gonna be fine shelling out ANOTHER couple of billions to clean up Chernobyl 2.0?
If this ever actually happens (Big IF) anyone who lies about it is gonna be completely fucked when the truth inevitably comes out.
Noone benefits from this.
Which way is the wind blowing?
We need a more trustworthy source. After Zelensky destroyed his own dam I don’t believe a word he says.
NAFO trolls downvoting every voice critical of Ukraine, I see you.
And thanks to blocklists we won’t have to see you ever again :)
Why would Russia blow up the NPP when they’re winning the war? This is another atrocity by the Ukrainian military to muddy the waters and try to attract yet more international support like the dam bombing.
Why would Russia blow up the NPP when they’re winning the war?
Right, but they are not, they are
barely holdinglosing ground.Meanwhile in the real world
And causing a nuclear disaster would help with this how? PS: When you hold part of your opponents country that means you’re winning.
causing a nuclear disaster would help with this how?
The plant is located near the front lines, along a probable route to the Sea of Azov. Blowing it up creates an obstacle, making advances and supplies more difficult.
When you hold part of your opponents country that means you’re winning.
That’s a stretch. Like Germany was winning WW2 until it was kicked out of France.
True, it’s probably the best Russia can achieve but far from their goals. And they’ve been losing ground steadily now.
They have a child-like mentality. If they can’t have it, then blow it up. Now no one gets it.
Please explain your argument, I do not think it makes any sense but instead dangerously misjudges the Russian government/military.
Assuming they have a child-like mentality:
- Why is there no massive bombardment of Ukrainian cities and infrastructure? Might as well do that for cities out of reach instead of blowing up a NPP.
- Why didn’t Putin order to have all Wagner soldiers killed after what happened a few days ago?
