• mang0@lemmy.zip
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    17 hours ago

    The amount of people who voted republican completely obliterates the tiny fraction of people who abstained from voting democrat. How about directing focus where it’s relevant?

    • Zorque@lemmy.world
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      15 hours ago

      The amount of people who sat home on voting day outweighs both republican and democrat voters. Apathy won the last presidential election, just like every election in recent memory.

        • Natanael@infosec.pub
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          13 hours ago

          Encouraging more democratic leaning voters would’ve made a difference however, you don’t have to assume linear proportional effect

          • Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            4 hours ago

            Encouraging more democratic leaning voters would’ve made a difference however, you don’t have to assume linear proportional effect

            Which is exactly the job of the Democrat Party leaders, which is done via amongst other things offering potential voters the things they desire and assuaging their concerns, things which are clearly not “Unwavering support of Israel and its Genocide”, “Do whatever is good for Finance and Tech-bros” or “Supporting the Cheney family, legacy and political ideology”.

            The people with by far the most power to convince leftwing leaning non-voters to vote for the Democrat Party were the Democrat Party leaders and they, with all that power they had, actually did the very opposite of trying to cater to the desires and concerns of such non-voters.

            Yet around here whenever american politics pops up as a subject we get a rabid pack of mindless useful idiots blaming non-voters literally for not convincing themselves to vote for a party whose leaders activelly tried to reject them, never blaming those fucking leaders for activelly rejecting said potential voters.

            Fuck the subservient, bootlicking Democrat Party tribalists who keep on excusing the profound incompetence and greed of their tribe’s “chiefs” and parroting the DNC propaganda line that pushes the blame to non-voters rather than accept that the blame for a fucking monster like Trump having been elected a second time is overwhelmingly of the DNC and the rest of the Democrat Party leadership who once again chose to “stay pretty close but just below” in the Evil scales from the Republicans

            Maybe it’s not so obvious for those living inside America and its Politics, but from the outside it’s obvious that both of Trump’s presidential election victories are the end product of decades of the Democrat Party leadership getting away with representing ever fewer people whilst relying on a “vote lesser evil” strategy, all of which supported by the very same useful idiots who now, once again, come out relentlessly parroting the “everybody but ourselves is to blame” mindless bullshit that only an acephalic tribalist muppet would believe.

            It is fucking obvious for anybody who knows just a bit of World History that Trump or somebody like him was bound to be elected sooner or later in the US when the strategy of the competing political force there was nothing more than invariably sidding with the handful of moneyed elites just limited by the need to stay just one step below in the Ladder of Evil from the other political force.

            So enjoy the Fall Of The Empire you created for yourselves (by supporting a “Greater Evil” vs “Lesser evil” political power structure) and for the other 340 million people over there, whilst the rest of us batters the hatches and endures the side effects of the “Empire overextending itself militarily whilst the homeland becomes ever empoverished and authoritarian” phase of such Fall until America fizzles in power (if you’re lucky) or breaks up.

    • Mulligrubs@lemmy.world
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      13 hours ago

      “tiny fraction of people” millions of registered D voters sat it out

      The DNC knew that Harris campaign pursuing Republican votes would cost her the election. She knew it, too, she’s not dumb.

      Independents outnumber Ds and Rs; if you ignore your own Democrats and ignore Independents and pursue Republican votes, you will lose every time.

      The math requires you to keep your own voters AND acquire Independent votes. There’s no way around it, not enough Ds exist, even if all had voted you still need I votes.

      This is why Democratic campaigns are otherwise always focused on D and I votes.

      Why did they ignore the fundamentals? You decide… but recall that she raised over a billion dollars in a few months, whilst Trump raised only 900 million in four years.

    • Chloé 🥕@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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      16 hours ago

      yeah but then how could libs feel smugly superior?

      they’d rather blame the tiny fraction of people with principles rather than the third of the country that is actively fascist, because politically, they’re closer to the fascists

      • Zorque@lemmy.world
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        15 hours ago

        I’d hardly take criticism from so called leftists regarding smugness.

        Blaming “liberals” for not voting on “principle” (re: ego) while they sit on their asses telling everyone else to form an armed rebellion instead certainly aren’t smug bastards themselves.

      • arnitbier@sh.itjust.works
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        12 hours ago

        Because they are the ones that knew but chose to play some bullshit game instead of putting their shit aside for the reality they knew was there but just made them feel uncomfortable.

        Its actually way worse in that way then the republicans who are nearly impossible to blame as they were and some still are totally convinced a fantasy reality was actually there at that time and can’t be held as accountable by blaming as much as they see it as a personal attack and it vindicates them if not put in language they understand.

        Tell the republicans to fuck themselves and it helps to remind them they’re supporting a pedo and a warmongerer. Hold them accountable with specifics actions he’s done against them and why its bad. Not a general you shouldn’t have voted for him because fantasyland reasoning

        You have to do their thinking for them entirely I’m learning, its like drugs, theyre addicted to people thinking for them, have to get them a healthy alternative to get them weaned so they can fend for themselves afterwards but not before that happens

        • M0oP0o@mander.xyz
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          12 hours ago

          play some bullshit game

          Oh I know this one, its the two party system pretending to be a democracy right?

          But I am things are bad because the wrong team is in power, and if they turn out to be great it is all due to the brave right team. But hey good thing you are there to “do their thinking for them entirely”!

          • arnitbier@sh.itjust.works
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            11 hours ago

            Jesus your contextual reading needs work

            Fox news ONN types need they’re thinking done for them.

            You need therapy and a fucking wake up call. This is reality not some ideological victimhood posturing contest. The two party system controlled by the media and the monetary powers that be run this shitshow (along with Russian gov misinformation campaigning and other fucking useful idiots)

            So spelled out. It was not a good time to take that fight and were all getting fucked up now because you fucked up your turn.

            Figure if they come for you, your family or a loved one and send them to some hellhole that might that might help you understand that. But have fun winning your “The world has to work how I want it before I participate” award. Wasn’t worth it IMO.

            Learn to play the actual game or get fucked by those that already do. Good fucking luck next turn. Do not fuck up this one

            • M0oP0o@mander.xyz
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              11 hours ago

              Fox news ONN types need they’re thinking done for them.

              And you see no issues with this statement? You need the wake up call, you live in a hellscape that is actively making the world worse and just assume I do too. You and your american exceptionalism can go to hell. The best time to fight was before and the next best time is now.

              Please do the world a favor and ether fix your shit nation or collapse already.

    • Jerkface (any/all)@lemmy.ca
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      16 hours ago

      Bologna. There are not enough conservative voters in virtually any nation to win in an election that progressive voters actually turn out to. Conservatives only win when progressives don’t vote; conservatives NEVER don’t vote.

      • PM_ME_VINTAGE_30S [he/him]@lemmy.sdf.org
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        15 hours ago

        But the moral prohibition on siding with any administration that endorses genocide will force a different flavor of the exact same logic that centrist liberalism has depended on for so long: hold your nose and align with the least worst thing. Only the least worst thing will no longer be the mild, ethics-agnostic emptiness of modern Western liberalism, nor will it be the multitude of barbaric authoritarians and their secret prisons. It will be communal solidarity, or else nothing, a walking away from all of this. Countless otherwise pragmatic people who would in any other circumstance choose liberalism by default will instead decide none of this is worth the damage to one’s soul. They will instead support no one, vote for no one, wash their hands of any ordering of the world that results in choices no better than this. And the obvious centrist refrain—But do you want the deranged right wing to win?—should, after even a moment of self-reflection, yield to a far more important question: How empty does your message have to be for a deranged right wing to even have a chance of winning? Of all the epitaphs that may one day be written on the gravestone of Western liberalism, the most damning is this: Faced off against a nihilistic, endlessly cruel manifestation of conservatism, and somehow managed to make it close.

        — Omar El-Akkad, One Day Everyone Will Have Always Been Against This, correction mine

        • Natanael@infosec.pub
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          13 hours ago

          That argument works when the difference is small.

          That argument doesn’t work when one option is a cataclysmic disaster

          But most importantly - when you look at what policies that Trump voters said they voted for, you could divide that into a fraction of voters voting for evil (plain stupid racists), and a large fraction voting for something positive which they had been told Trump would deliver - yet which he was objectively worse at. Most people voted Trump for the economy while told he was a great businessman, or for healthcare while told he’d make health insurance more affordable (but now he made it less), etc…

          Almost every positive impact in the last decades that his voters attributed to him was delivered by his opposition.

          This wasn’t an election lost to attrition. Your quote explains nothing about what happened.

          There was more votes than ever. It was lost to propaganda and people being idiots, not seeing through the fraud. Trump’s policies lost every poll when names were taken off. Everything he wanted to do kept being rejected. But the propaganda machine made people distrust the people who delivered all the things they said they were grateful for, and to trust the liar instead.

          • PM_ME_VINTAGE_30S [he/him]@lemmy.sdf.org
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            13 hours ago

            Implying that a Harris/second Biden administration wouldn’t be a cataclysmic disaster

            Implying that any outcome where AmeriKKKa continues to exist and destroy our world wouldn’t be a cataclysmic disaster

            • Natanael@infosec.pub
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              13 hours ago

              If you can not understand a difference in scale then your school years was a cataclysmic disaster

              • M0oP0o@mander.xyz
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                12 hours ago

                Maybe they went to an Arkansas school, or any other american one that teaches people to only support the terrible system.

                But hey! You voted right so you can be smug and its only fair you get to point your impotent rage at those who did not vote the way you did. And next time when the two parties are both somehow worse you can once again vote for the lesser evil!

      • mang0@lemmy.zip
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        16 hours ago

        Republican voters voted for this. Non-voters didn’t vote, hence the name. I can’t believe I have to tell you this. Even if there wasn’t a single non-voter, nothing would’ve changed. Try directing your douchebag attitude towards those who are actually responsible.

        • edible_funk@lemmy.world
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          14 hours ago

          Non voters voted for this by virtue of being too stupid to know how our system works. They deserve responsibility.

        • aesthelete@lemmy.world
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          15 hours ago

          I agree that saying “non-voters voted for” anything is basically absurd, but people sitting on the couch rather than voting did affect the outcome of the 2024 election. A bit over three million fewer people voted in 2024 than 2020.

          • M0oP0o@mander.xyz
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            12 hours ago

            Yes, the second and first most voted elections in your nations history. Clearly it is the small number of voters that are not supportive of the only two options at fault.

            Managed democracy is meant to be a joke, but the real joke is the attitude on display from americans that somehow still think they live in a democracy.

        • Typhoon@lemmy.ca
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          14 hours ago

          Every non-voter was fine with this outcome because they couldn’t sack up and make the less bad choice. If you see a car coming towards a child in the road and do nothing you are still partly responsible if they get hit. They allowed it to happen through their inaction.

          • Zorque@lemmy.world
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            15 hours ago

            Responsibility for someone else’s vote?

            All the people making excuses for why their vote clearly didn’t matter so they were better off not voting obviously aren’t making excuses themselves. That would be silly!

        • BarqsHasBite@lemmy.world
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          16 hours ago

          Republicans by and large know what they voted for. Protest-non-voters need to be informed what they in fact voted for, as you demonstrate.

          Ah yes see you’re looking to assign responsiblity. Again, I am informing protest-non-voters what they voted for.

      • SulaymanF@lemmy.world
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        16 hours ago

        There’s been polling analysis that showed if you forced everyone to vote then Harris would have lost to Trump by an even bigger margin due to the unpopularity of the administration at the time. Nonvoters didn’t make a difference. Michigan was won by Trump by a bigger margin than all college students or Arabs or Muslims or any other minority group in the state.

        • BarqsHasBite@lemmy.world
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          16 hours ago

          I think you’re trying to assign blame. Again, I am informing non-protest-voters what they voted for.