Man. Any one else here old enough to remember when Democrats were handed their anti-war mandate in 2008, and then Obama went on to get the high score in US led wedding drone strikes?
Anyways. If Democrats do nothing with the mandates they are given, voters inevitably gravitate towards whomever will promise them change, because ultimately, thats what voters have been asking for 30 years.
Obama inherited two illegal wars and a financial implosion, his goal was to divest from those wars with the minimum amount of USAF casualties, and opted for drones.
What was he supposed to do, just a full scale military retreat? That would have been a hundred times worse.
I hate this single one criticism against Obama that the right always pushes, because he did what best he could being handed a complete clusterfuck of a geopolitical situation.
All of that blame rests firmly on the side of the Republicans.
Yes, you can withdraw from an occupation of another country at any time. Nobody is forcing you to be there. It just might liss of the people making the money for you to leave. But hey, it’s only brown kids dying, am I right!? Who cares about that.
You’re right - Obama had no choice but to drone strike Pakistanis based on if they sit down or stand up when they pee. Makes total sense, peace prize earned, fist bump that great guy.
He got the peace prize for being the first black president, breaking an over two hundred year old taboo in a nation priding itself on its liberty, if not its history of slavery and violence. It was a coming to terms, a reckoning, and it was, and it is.
If we are talking about geopolitics, yeah no, you don’t start with a fresh board when you become president. You’re knee deep in shit that’s been accumulating for a century, you have alliances, you have covert ops, you have wars, you have puppet dictators, you have vested economic interests as a matter of being responsible for the nation’s continued existence- most of which was built on slavery, military power, subterfuge, assassinations, uncomfortable alliances, and a vast network of tentacles controlling global industrial infrastructures.
Yeah, you don’t just get to say “we’re not gonna do this anymore”, because the USA is way in too deep at this point. There were literally military engagements going on at that point that you couldn’t just withdraw from without creating way more chaos and destruction.
You have to see it from that perspective. It’s disingenuous pointing at what is in the greater scope genuine details in how the USA has been waging foreign politics for the past century.
It was much better than what the Republicans had done if they had stayed in power. Obama did what he could with what he had and he did a shitload of good, but it’s ridiculous suggesting there is any semblance of equivalence between him and the people who created the wars for profit that enriched the Bush dynasty and their cronies.
Lots of excuses here. For skin color? For having a hard job?
He signed off on drone strikes targeting people based on how they were peeing. That was all the intel they had on these people and they reined down hell. On multiple people every week, for years, for his entire presidency.
That’s not a military engagement. He’s a murderer. Don’t make excuses for a murderer.
I hate this single one criticism against Obama that the right always pushes, because he did what best he could being handed a complete clusterfuck of a geopolitical situation.
Apologize for their capitulation to the military industrial complex more. It was a situation the US created and which Obama extended. Needlessly. Did they 8 additional years they extended the war help Iraq or hurt Iraq? Did it help Afghanistan or hurt Afghanistan. Did it help the US or hurt the US?
This is baby brain level liberalism. You should change your handle.
Be less of a fucking shitty liberal and I wonʻt have to slap you around so much. Fucking citing the name of our lord anarchism and then defending a fucking liberal war criminal. Go fucking pay your taxes.
Member when the Snowden leaks happened and Obama/Dems worked hand in hand with R’s to continue the implementation of turnkey totalitarianism?
Member when we argued that they were building the machinery necessary to easily commit genocide and enslave everyone in a panopticon police state FOR FASCISM; that the very existence of this machinery itself was fundamentally authoritarian and anti-democratic… and the shitlib majority believed the government could never turn against the people; that entertaining this threat was an insane conspiracy theory?
This extreme level of gross negligence, criminal incompetence, and overall systemic failure — unilaterally across all of western “democracy” — is an indicator that we do not live in democracies, but in dictatorships of capital; that classical liberalism itself is failing humanity and the planet; incompatible with democracy, sustainability, and the long term survival of the species.
That’s what a lot of these copiod posters tend to forget, or simply weren’t alive for. It’s great the dems are using populist messaging again, but we’ve been here before. In fact we’ve been here so often it’s kinda annoying.
But hey, here’s either another example of the dems acting as no more than a ratchet, or, maybe, improbably, they’ll do the right thing and start enacting the overwhelmingly popular bipartisan policies like isolationist defensive military strategy, local manufacturing and labor incentives, and medicare for all.
Watching these reruns while the ecological clock runs out is a bit worse than annoying.
I think they actually can’t implement medicare for all, because healthcare in the US is so far gone that M4A would undermine the entire system.
How long now have people been told it’s impossible? How much the relief when profit-seeking is removed from the equation? How many people will then wonder what other lies they’ve taken for granted?
This fucking purity testing, we went from some of the evilest fucking jackals tearing the nation apart starting illegal wars for profit that crashed the global economy and people are like “wHaT aBoUT ObaMaS dRoNes?!”
You do understand that wars with a 5 trillion dollar budget aren’t just ended because you say so as a president? Obama’s line was to divest from those wars while minimizing US casualties, which was a massive point of contention back then, too many fucking US soldiers died and Obama opted for drones over having servicemen killed on the ground.
Nobody wanted those fucking wars except Bush and cronies. Sometimes there isn’t a perfect solution when you get the handover, you got to do damage control and at that time drones were the lesser of the evils.
“Obama’s drones” is just “Hillary’s emails” in disguise.
Drones are so much better am I right!? Now only those people die. So you don’t have to think about it, and we can all sleep better at night knowing it’s over there instead of here.
Man. Any one else here old enough to remember when Democrats were handed their anti-war mandate in 2008, and then Obama went on to get the high score in US led wedding drone strikes?
Anyways. If Democrats do nothing with the mandates they are given, voters inevitably gravitate towards whomever will promise them change, because ultimately, thats what voters have been asking for 30 years.
Obama inherited two illegal wars and a financial implosion, his goal was to divest from those wars with the minimum amount of USAF casualties, and opted for drones.
What was he supposed to do, just a full scale military retreat? That would have been a hundred times worse.
I hate this single one criticism against Obama that the right always pushes, because he did what best he could being handed a complete clusterfuck of a geopolitical situation.
All of that blame rests firmly on the side of the Republicans.
Yes, you can withdraw from an occupation of another country at any time. Nobody is forcing you to be there. It just might liss of the people making the money for you to leave. But hey, it’s only brown kids dying, am I right!? Who cares about that.
You’re right - Obama had no choice but to drone strike Pakistanis based on if they sit down or stand up when they pee. Makes total sense, peace prize earned, fist bump that great guy.
He got the peace prize for being the first black president, breaking an over two hundred year old taboo in a nation priding itself on its liberty, if not its history of slavery and violence. It was a coming to terms, a reckoning, and it was, and it is.
If we are talking about geopolitics, yeah no, you don’t start with a fresh board when you become president. You’re knee deep in shit that’s been accumulating for a century, you have alliances, you have covert ops, you have wars, you have puppet dictators, you have vested economic interests as a matter of being responsible for the nation’s continued existence- most of which was built on slavery, military power, subterfuge, assassinations, uncomfortable alliances, and a vast network of tentacles controlling global industrial infrastructures.
Yeah, you don’t just get to say “we’re not gonna do this anymore”, because the USA is way in too deep at this point. There were literally military engagements going on at that point that you couldn’t just withdraw from without creating way more chaos and destruction.
You have to see it from that perspective. It’s disingenuous pointing at what is in the greater scope genuine details in how the USA has been waging foreign politics for the past century.
It was much better than what the Republicans had done if they had stayed in power. Obama did what he could with what he had and he did a shitload of good, but it’s ridiculous suggesting there is any semblance of equivalence between him and the people who created the wars for profit that enriched the Bush dynasty and their cronies.
Lots of excuses here. For skin color? For having a hard job?
He signed off on drone strikes targeting people based on how they were peeing. That was all the intel they had on these people and they reined down hell. On multiple people every week, for years, for his entire presidency.
That’s not a military engagement. He’s a murderer. Don’t make excuses for a murderer.
Not very.
Apologize for their capitulation to the military industrial complex more. It was a situation the US created and which Obama extended. Needlessly. Did they 8 additional years they extended the war help Iraq or hurt Iraq? Did it help Afghanistan or hurt Afghanistan. Did it help the US or hurt the US?
This is baby brain level liberalism. You should change your handle.
löl you are not a tropical ding dong!
It was a situation that BUSH and cronies created, for profit, that shook the global economy to its core. That’s what Obama inherited.
But you’re literally just “both sidesing” this shit, are you a .ml user or something?
Reads like something someone with a not immeasurable blood lead level would think.
no U r stupid
great arguments here. My point is proven.
Be less of a fucking shitty liberal and I wonʻt have to slap you around so much. Fucking citing the name of our lord anarchism and then defending a fucking liberal war criminal. Go fucking pay your taxes.
Member when the Snowden leaks happened and Obama/Dems worked hand in hand with R’s to continue the implementation of turnkey totalitarianism?
Member when we argued that they were building the machinery necessary to easily commit genocide and enslave everyone in a panopticon police state FOR FASCISM; that the very existence of this machinery itself was fundamentally authoritarian and anti-democratic… and the shitlib majority believed the government could never turn against the people; that entertaining this threat was an insane conspiracy theory?
This extreme level of gross negligence, criminal incompetence, and overall systemic failure — unilaterally across all of western “democracy” — is an indicator that we do not live in democracies, but in dictatorships of capital; that classical liberalism itself is failing humanity and the planet; incompatible with democracy, sustainability, and the long term survival of the species.
Those kinds of events are why the progressives have been gaining so much steam
Support progressives, not centrist democrats
That’s what a lot of these copiod posters tend to forget, or simply weren’t alive for. It’s great the dems are using populist messaging again, but we’ve been here before. In fact we’ve been here so often it’s kinda annoying.
But hey, here’s either another example of the dems acting as no more than a ratchet, or, maybe, improbably, they’ll do the right thing and start enacting the overwhelmingly popular bipartisan policies like isolationist defensive military strategy, local manufacturing and labor incentives, and medicare for all.
Watching these reruns while the ecological clock runs out is a bit worse than annoying.
I think they actually can’t implement medicare for all, because healthcare in the US is so far gone that M4A would undermine the entire system.
How long now have people been told it’s impossible? How much the relief when profit-seeking is removed from the equation? How many people will then wonder what other lies they’ve taken for granted?
I remember. Then when I was upset about it, people were shocked I didn’t like “the best modern president, maybe even of all time”.
This fucking purity testing, we went from some of the evilest fucking jackals tearing the nation apart starting illegal wars for profit that crashed the global economy and people are like “wHaT aBoUT ObaMaS dRoNes?!”
You do understand that wars with a 5 trillion dollar budget aren’t just ended because you say so as a president? Obama’s line was to divest from those wars while minimizing US casualties, which was a massive point of contention back then, too many fucking US soldiers died and Obama opted for drones over having servicemen killed on the ground.
Nobody wanted those fucking wars except Bush and cronies. Sometimes there isn’t a perfect solution when you get the handover, you got to do damage control and at that time drones were the lesser of the evils.
“Obama’s drones” is just “Hillary’s emails” in disguise.
Drones are so much better am I right!? Now only those people die. So you don’t have to think about it, and we can all sleep better at night knowing it’s over there instead of here.
He was actually the best american president maybe of all time, top five for sure. That says more about american presidents than about Obama
Exactly
Same here. Everyone acted like Obama was so great just because he wasn’t Bush.