It’s more of a pragmatic position than a political one. The “both sides are the same” people aren’t exactly right, it’s more “both sides are bad”.
As for whether I qualify as a “liberal”, there are so many definitions for the word that it doesn’t matter. In the example though it’s being used as a slur basically. There is nothing worse you can be called on Lemmy than a liberal.
You still seem stuck on the idea that winning the German election was important. I’m reminding you again that it took hitler approximately 1 year to go from losing that election to consolidating absolute power.
I’d say Trump isn’t much better, but the Gaza Peace Plan is an improvement over the status quo from before. But the parallels between Trump and Hitler are far stronger than between Biden and Hitler, especially on domestic policy.
I’m not faulting people for not voting in 2024, Trump was more of a wildcard than Biden. Voting Biden in guaranteed a continued genocide but nobody knew what Trump would do.
Trump is an exception to the Republican rule, his foreign policy is very idiosyncratic and his domestic policy is more mask-off (metaphorically, not literally). The Republican party behind him is more uniform in their unconditional support for Israel. The Democrat party is fractured on that front and broadly (though not unanimously) united against the most murderous of Trump’s domestic policies.
Maybe abstaining or voting third-party will incite a communist revolution, I don’t know, but right now more people are dying than would under a Democrat senate majority and I don’t see them being able to make things worse in Gaza (and they’re not really ideologically pro-genocide, they just don’t care as long as they have access to Israeli military bases).
You wouldn’t really be getting more time though. Fascism is capitalism self-preservation response, if you started successfully mass-organizing under Hindenburg, the state would start putting in a lot of the same policies Hitler did later on. You need to act decisively and with enough force to overpower the state. Mind you, it’s not exactly like the means the Nazis seized power was especially legitimate.
You’re acting like the nazis were waiting to be given power legitimately when they in fact abolished any democracy the moment they were able to get away with it. The timeline here wasn’t driven by “can hitler get enough votes to win”, hitler took power however he could (he didn’t win the vote) and abolished voting as soon as he was able. I don’t know why you think that voting against the people who plan to abolish the right to vote will do anything, they literally openly do not respect the practice or the outcomes of votes. Politically, you are staring at the shadows on the wall of Plato’s cave and getting mad at people asking you to actually exit the cave and do something that might have an effect against fascists.
If we had the electoral power you losers think we have, why aren’t you bending the knee to us instead of moderate Republicans who fantasize about throwing you into meat grinders
We aren’t ever gonna bend the knee either, so you can either start practicing your lunges or start practicing your goose stepping. I’m pretty sure I know which one you’ll choose.
Communists who are blessed and cursed with pattern recognition: the Democrats and Republicans are part of the same omnicidal capitalist machine, and neither has any interest in changing the increasingly unbearable status quo.
If you want to talk about “reality”, you’ll quickly find yourself ostracized by Democrat supporters. Free Palestine.
Do you honestly believe “the Democrats and Republicans are exactly the same”. Do you not accept that the abortion policy of the Democrats is better, for example?
When have the Democrats actually defended abortion? They’ve had plenty of opportunities to codify it as a right, but they don’t actually want to do that. Their abortion policy is worse than Republicans because they’re dishonest about wanting to protect it, while the Republicans are honest about being assholes who don’t believe women should have rights.
Social democrats who live in reality: The Democrats are better than Republicans.
Lemmy Communists: Liberal!!!
Yes? That’s a very liberal position.
I didn’t even catch that TBH, but the implication that social democrats somehow AREN’T liberals is funny.
It’s more of a pragmatic position than a political one. The “both sides are the same” people aren’t exactly right, it’s more “both sides are bad”.
As for whether I qualify as a “liberal”, there are so many definitions for the word that it doesn’t matter. In the example though it’s being used as a slur basically. There is nothing worse you can be called on Lemmy than a liberal.
You’ve spent this entire conversation loudly espousing your support for various flavors of Hitler. Derision is the least you deserve.
If you think that’s what I’ve been doing, you need better reading comprehension.
The last refuge of the online loser
By that logic, Hindenburg was “better” than Hitler, but choosing one still got you the other in the end.
You can guarantee yourself Hitler, or you can pragmatically choose Hindenburg and give your country a chance.
The only correct choice in that election was Thälmann.
If he had a chance of winning, yes.
You still seem stuck on the idea that winning the German election was important. I’m reminding you again that it took hitler approximately 1 year to go from losing that election to consolidating absolute power.
Most historically literate liberal
historians are still trying to figure out how this happened /s
Or, maybe, you could actively resist the system that gets you Hitler no matter who you vote for through direct action and organizing?
Yeah, but maybe give yourself more time to do that by, for example, not electing Hitler.
Remind me why the Democrats had the nicknames “Genocide Joe” and “Holocaust Harris”
I’d say Trump isn’t much better, but the Gaza Peace Plan is an improvement over the status quo from before. But the parallels between Trump and Hitler are far stronger than between Biden and Hitler, especially on domestic policy.
I’m not faulting people for not voting in 2024, Trump was more of a wildcard than Biden. Voting Biden in guaranteed a continued genocide but nobody knew what Trump would do.
Trump is an exception to the Republican rule, his foreign policy is very idiosyncratic and his domestic policy is more mask-off (metaphorically, not literally). The Republican party behind him is more uniform in their unconditional support for Israel. The Democrat party is fractured on that front and broadly (though not unanimously) united against the most murderous of Trump’s domestic policies.
Maybe abstaining or voting third-party will incite a communist revolution, I don’t know, but right now more people are dying than would under a Democrat senate majority and I don’t see them being able to make things worse in Gaza (and they’re not really ideologically pro-genocide, they just don’t care as long as they have access to Israeli military bases).
This logic works if you see non-Americans as Untermenschen. But if you don’t then Trumps sheer incompetence is the lesser evil for the world.
You wouldn’t really be getting more time though. Fascism is capitalism self-preservation response, if you started successfully mass-organizing under Hindenburg, the state would start putting in a lot of the same policies Hitler did later on. You need to act decisively and with enough force to overpower the state. Mind you, it’s not exactly like the means the Nazis seized power was especially legitimate.
there is no way you are this ignorant, there no hope for libs
are you aware of what happened when hindenburg was elected
After skimming wikipedia, yes. I’m also aware of what would’ve happened if Hitler was elected instead.
“No.” The response you were looking for was “No.”
Literally exactly the same thing?
The exact same thing, but faster and with less uncertainty.
You’re acting like the nazis were waiting to be given power legitimately when they in fact abolished any democracy the moment they were able to get away with it. The timeline here wasn’t driven by “can hitler get enough votes to win”, hitler took power however he could (he didn’t win the vote) and abolished voting as soon as he was able. I don’t know why you think that voting against the people who plan to abolish the right to vote will do anything, they literally openly do not respect the practice or the outcomes of votes. Politically, you are staring at the shadows on the wall of Plato’s cave and getting mad at people asking you to actually exit the cave and do something that might have an effect against fascists.
Liberals be playing Hitler Gatcha lmfao
And lemmy communists be playing Hitler cookie clicker.
If we had the electoral power you losers think we have, why aren’t you bending the knee to us instead of moderate Republicans who fantasize about throwing you into meat grinders
I’m not the one who needs to bend the knee, and those “moderate Republicans” aren’t ever going to.
Plus you’re all kind of obnoxious so I wouldn’t really want to be associated with you publicly.
Ah yes, the classic “the tankies are loud and mean so I HAD TO BECOME A FASCIST”
Not loud and mean, smug and delusional.
Okay have fun electing Hitler then.
Correction: “Moderate Hitler”.
We aren’t ever gonna bend the knee either, so you can either start practicing your lunges or start practicing your goose stepping. I’m pretty sure I know which one you’ll choose.
I’m not telling you to, mostly because it wouldn’t work. I’m just saying that despite how smart you all think you are, you don’t live in reality.
I almost upvoted this because I thought it was a really funny joke. Liberalism is washed.
Communists who are blessed and cursed with pattern recognition: the Democrats and Republicans are part of the same omnicidal capitalist machine, and neither has any interest in changing the increasingly unbearable status quo.
If you want to talk about “reality”, you’ll quickly find yourself ostracized by Democrat supporters. Free Palestine.
The oligarchs who own America are not a monolith, nor is congress. The Democrats and Republicans are in reality, slightly different.
Do you honestly believe “the Democrats and Republicans are exactly the same”. Do you not accept that the abortion policy of the Democrats is better, for example?
The abortion policy of the Democrats is to roll over for the Republicans
When have the Democrats actually defended abortion? They’ve had plenty of opportunities to codify it as a right, but they don’t actually want to do that. Their abortion policy is worse than Republicans because they’re dishonest about wanting to protect it, while the Republicans are honest about being assholes who don’t believe women should have rights.