Jon Stewart torched the DNC and Democratic leadership as "lost" after learning from a candidate with a massive lead that he's heard zilch from the party.
I think you’re wrong. Or rather, I think you’re mostly wrong.
Like, in no way do I think they are extremely good at what they do, unless your argument is that they don’t give a shit, which I also think is wrong. They definitely want to win. They definitely want to control things. They literally make more money (not the organization, mind you, the people who run the organization) when they are in control. It is silly to think otherwise. Heck, it is safer, too!
But, I think they are quite dumb, or maybe it’s better to think of them as out of touch. They rely on political calculus, but they’re using some pretty bad variables. Because otherwise, there wouldn’t be any progressive Democrats at all. Like, that is inherently detrimental to their centrism. Giving crumbs isn’t as useful to them as people say because it let’s others know how hungry they are for more of that. Hope is contagious.
I think they work with what they got, and what they got is so rapidly changing that they freak out and pick what they think is the safest option over and over again. And their base hates it, but they’ll deal with that part later, there’s just too many fires for them!
Like, sure, there’s a little bit of trying to control how progressive they can be, but they just… Suck at that, too. I dunno, man. A lot of people can skate by on incompetency, and that just feels more likely.
If they wanted to win they would release the 2024 election autopsy. Instead they buried it. Yes, they dont mind winning elections but they absolutely would rather lose than allow progressives in power. They just buried the election autopsy a week ago and now everyone forgot about it. Same thing trump relies on to stay in power.
Folks like you being unrealistic about what we can all see happening is a huge part of their enablement.
“Gosh, golly, we blew it again, so sorry everyone! Being the good guys, we have a harder challenge, we have to fight for change the right way. Sometimes we lose by sticking to our principles 😞”
Yeah fucking right. Of course they’d prefer themselves be the current half dominating the other, but not so they can make any kind of sweeping changes. Just because it’s cushier on top. And yes, the DNC is where the folks who sincerely do want to fix things end up. And just look how they’re prevented from ever getting anything done. They get co-opted and sidelined, another major function of the party. Absorb the true believers and thereby dull and mute their influence.
The moment Dems have actual control and power - even for a moment - as soon as it’s theirs they roll over. Recent shutdown capitulation was a perfect example, but it’s just over and over and over. I’m not claiming every rank and file Democrat politician is “in on it”, I’m claiming it doesn’t matter, if the party structure and behavior is obviously corrupt and strictly self-serving as the commenter you’re replying to laid out.
It’s rich people against us, Dem leadership is against us. Please stop being so naive. Your naivete is a literal weapon they wield to abuse us all.
I don’t believe I disagreed with the assertion that the DNC leadership wants to make sweeping changes. I said that they are NOT some type of controlled opposition. If they were, they wouldn’t be fucking up as hard as they do at every aspect you stated. They are a combination of inefficient, out-of-touch, greedy, and… Lazy, but like they want everyone to like them which makes them inauthentic?
I think it’s unrealistic to think the DNC is smart enough to undermine everything but somehow not smart enough to just… Lie better? You know? Why bother being so fucking pathetic when it is easier, cheaper, and faster to just lie? Why make an autopsy on why you lost the election and burying it because of your Israeli money ties if you were a genius and could just make a fake report that blames progressive policies real fucking easily.
Like, sure, call them sociopaths and everything because the DNC is having to defend legitimately bad positions in spite of its supporters opposition because money, but don’t pretend that is out of some masterminded technique. They are not that smart.
My assertion is the DNC leadership does not want to make sweeping changes, wants to avoid them at all costs, but nonetheless position themselves as the party of ChangeTM, thus necessitating all the lip service to ideals like justice and fairness, while constantly stacking the deck against citizens.
I don’t know where you’re getting the idea that I think they are mastermind geniuses, I think they are pretty garden-variety “pretend to look busy/effective while working for my actual interests” type liars, you can see that kind of behavior in any large corporate environment, too, it’s ubiquitous. Gets more disingenuous, and common to the point of being mere table stakes, the higher one goes on those rungs too. Usually.
So I’m just not willing to call their failures incompetence. It’s not a unified monolith of course, but the Chuck Schumer’s of the world know EXACTLY what they’re doing. And they’re no dummies, even if I don’t think they’re some kind of magically-capable puppetmasters.
It’s as simple as their interests being much more similar to that of their peers (of either party), and to the donors for both parties, and miles away from our interests. I’m not claiming special abilities, just regular tier competence. You seem to be insisting instead that it’s incompetence with the right goals, and I don’t see the evidence for that. I DO see lots of PR.
They’re controlled in the sense that they represent class interests that are opposed to those of their nominal constituency. By paying some lip service to vaguely progressive policies, they capture roughly half of the voters in a system built to exclude any real working-class political representation.
I think you’re wrong. Or rather, I think you’re mostly wrong.
Like, in no way do I think they are extremely good at what they do, unless your argument is that they don’t give a shit, which I also think is wrong. They definitely want to win. They definitely want to control things. They literally make more money (not the organization, mind you, the people who run the organization) when they are in control. It is silly to think otherwise. Heck, it is safer, too!
But, I think they are quite dumb, or maybe it’s better to think of them as out of touch. They rely on political calculus, but they’re using some pretty bad variables. Because otherwise, there wouldn’t be any progressive Democrats at all. Like, that is inherently detrimental to their centrism. Giving crumbs isn’t as useful to them as people say because it let’s others know how hungry they are for more of that. Hope is contagious.
I think they work with what they got, and what they got is so rapidly changing that they freak out and pick what they think is the safest option over and over again. And their base hates it, but they’ll deal with that part later, there’s just too many fires for them!
Like, sure, there’s a little bit of trying to control how progressive they can be, but they just… Suck at that, too. I dunno, man. A lot of people can skate by on incompetency, and that just feels more likely.
If they wanted to win they would release the 2024 election autopsy. Instead they buried it. Yes, they dont mind winning elections but they absolutely would rather lose than allow progressives in power. They just buried the election autopsy a week ago and now everyone forgot about it. Same thing trump relies on to stay in power.
Folks like you being unrealistic about what we can all see happening is a huge part of their enablement.
“Gosh, golly, we blew it again, so sorry everyone! Being the good guys, we have a harder challenge, we have to fight for change the right way. Sometimes we lose by sticking to our principles 😞”
Yeah fucking right. Of course they’d prefer themselves be the current half dominating the other, but not so they can make any kind of sweeping changes. Just because it’s cushier on top. And yes, the DNC is where the folks who sincerely do want to fix things end up. And just look how they’re prevented from ever getting anything done. They get co-opted and sidelined, another major function of the party. Absorb the true believers and thereby dull and mute their influence.
The moment Dems have actual control and power - even for a moment - as soon as it’s theirs they roll over. Recent shutdown capitulation was a perfect example, but it’s just over and over and over. I’m not claiming every rank and file Democrat politician is “in on it”, I’m claiming it doesn’t matter, if the party structure and behavior is obviously corrupt and strictly self-serving as the commenter you’re replying to laid out.
It’s rich people against us, Dem leadership is against us. Please stop being so naive. Your naivete is a literal weapon they wield to abuse us all.
I don’t believe I disagreed with the assertion that the DNC leadership wants to make sweeping changes. I said that they are NOT some type of controlled opposition. If they were, they wouldn’t be fucking up as hard as they do at every aspect you stated. They are a combination of inefficient, out-of-touch, greedy, and… Lazy, but like they want everyone to like them which makes them inauthentic?
I think it’s unrealistic to think the DNC is smart enough to undermine everything but somehow not smart enough to just… Lie better? You know? Why bother being so fucking pathetic when it is easier, cheaper, and faster to just lie? Why make an autopsy on why you lost the election and burying it because of your Israeli money ties if you were a genius and could just make a fake report that blames progressive policies real fucking easily.
Like, sure, call them sociopaths and everything because the DNC is having to defend legitimately bad positions in spite of its supporters opposition because money, but don’t pretend that is out of some masterminded technique. They are not that smart.
My assertion is the DNC leadership does not want to make sweeping changes, wants to avoid them at all costs, but nonetheless position themselves as the party of ChangeTM, thus necessitating all the lip service to ideals like justice and fairness, while constantly stacking the deck against citizens.
I don’t know where you’re getting the idea that I think they are mastermind geniuses, I think they are pretty garden-variety “pretend to look busy/effective while working for my actual interests” type liars, you can see that kind of behavior in any large corporate environment, too, it’s ubiquitous. Gets more disingenuous, and common to the point of being mere table stakes, the higher one goes on those rungs too. Usually.
So I’m just not willing to call their failures incompetence. It’s not a unified monolith of course, but the Chuck Schumer’s of the world know EXACTLY what they’re doing. And they’re no dummies, even if I don’t think they’re some kind of magically-capable puppetmasters.
It’s as simple as their interests being much more similar to that of their peers (of either party), and to the donors for both parties, and miles away from our interests. I’m not claiming special abilities, just regular tier competence. You seem to be insisting instead that it’s incompetence with the right goals, and I don’t see the evidence for that. I DO see lots of PR.
They’re controlled in the sense that they represent class interests that are opposed to those of their nominal constituency. By paying some lip service to vaguely progressive policies, they capture roughly half of the voters in a system built to exclude any real working-class political representation.