Israeli media has debunked the ultra-Orthodox group Zaka’s gruesome October 7 atrocity stories, but the American press won’t do it.

Zaka stories have been essential to justifying Israel’s all-out war against Gaza, which has killed around 30,000 Palestinians in less than five months. Speaking at the United Nations in December, Zaka deputy commander Simcha Greiniman broke down while describing alleged atrocities. He later told the same stories to a meeting of British parliamentarians.

Even when Western media outlets have questioned Landau, the inquiries were half-hearted. The Times asked Landau “about reports, attributed to him, that children had been beheaded on Oct. 7.” It reported: “Mr. Landau denied making the claim, though he acknowledged sometimes misspeaking in the immediate aftermath of the attack. What he saw himself, he said, was a small, burned body with at least part of the head missing, perhaps severed by the force of a blast. It was unclear, he added, if it was the body of teenager or someone younger.”

While the Times said the statements had been “attributed” to Landau, there is no dispute he said them. He told the stories on camera, and the clips were posted widely online. He told CNN he found “a body, of a 14, 15-year-old. Head chopped off. We were looking around for the head. Couldn’t find it.” On India’s Republic TV, Landau said of beheaded children, “Yes, this occurred. This happened.” He made similar comments to Channel 14 Israel and CBS News. There is no evidence Hamas beheaded children or babies. As The Intercept reported at the time, the Israeli military said it couldn’t confirm the claims just four days after the attack.

Media outlets, including Israeli television news programs, have debunked numerous stories about dead babies, calling them “fictional.”

  • Linkerbaan@lemmy.worldOPEnglish
    75·
    9 months ago

    An IDF doctor statement is your “evidence”?

    The same party that lied about rapes on Oct7, and are actual rapists are your credible source?

    If only the IDF allowed interviews with the released hostages. But they don’t since the first interviews with released hostages all said they were treated well which is bad optics when the IDF is the side actually doing the raping.

    And again no forensic evidence this time from women that are alive… 🤔

    • FlowVoid@lemmy.worldEnglish
      37·
      9 months ago

      Ah yes, it’s back to “Believe women - unless they are Jews”.

      I’m sure you will also dismiss testimony from 10/7 survivors who witnessed women being raped by Hamas, because they don’t fit your narrative.

      • Linkerbaan@lemmy.worldOPEnglish
        55·
        9 months ago

        Who’s that he was not in the article. New IDF recruit?

        The “witness” in the article changed his story like 3 times until he saw beheaded women which provably didn’t exist. And at the moment he was supposedly seeing the rape he was talking rad selfies.

        Oh yeah and his friend which was there right next to him did not corroborate the story.

        Just so many rapes and zero evidence ever collected. Really sad and coincidental you’d almost think the IDF was lying to manufacture consent for Genocide. The IDF would never lie right?

        • FlowVoid@lemmy.worldEnglish
          36·
          9 months ago

          Zero evidence if you ignore eyewitness evidence. I guess you think basically nobody should ever be found guilty of rape.

          Furthermore, the first witness did not contradict his story. In the TikTok video he describes Hamas murders, and in the later interview he describes the same Hamas murders and goes on to describe the rapes. Those accounts are consistent.

          The second witness described Hamas rapes to the AP as well as in his video.

          Of course since they are Israeli, they must have served in the IDF. It’s compulsory. So if you don’t believe anyone who served in the IDF that’s equivalent to not believing Jews, a pretty typical attitude for Hamas defenders.

          • Linkerbaan@lemmy.worldOPEnglish
            46·
            9 months ago

            Yes just like the 40 beheaded babies in ovens. Here’s an article that you might fight interesting:

            Scroll down to the section “Allegations of Systematic Rape”

            A small preview:

            Shari Mendes, an architect serving in the IDF reserves in a rabbinical unit, was deployed to a morgue to prepare bodies for burial after the attacks. An American originally from New Jersey, Mendes did multiple TV and print interviews about her experiences. “We have seen women who have been raped, from the age of children through to the elderly,” she told reporters, emphasizing, “This is not just something we saw on the internet, we saw these bodies with our own eyes.”

            For months, Mendes has served as one of the most visible witnesses bolstering Israel’s allegations of systematic rape. But few media outlets featuring her claims have mentioned the valid concerns about her credibility and her history of promoting a false story. She told the Daily Mail last October, “A baby was cut out of a pregnant woman and beheaded and then the mother was beheaded.”

            On December 5, as Israel engaged in a global media push around its allegations that Hamas had committed mass rapes, Mendes was a featured speaker at an event in New York organized by Israel’s mission to the U.N. on sexual violence and the October 7 attacks. The Times of Israel reported that Mendes “is not legally qualified to determine rape.”

            • FlowVoid@lemmy.worldEnglish
              35·
              9 months ago

              This article doesn’t seriously question whether rapes occurred, even acknowledging “Sexual violence is common in warfare”. It just says that rape wasn’t part of an organized campaign, and for all I know it may be right.

              The fact that Israel has not produced forensic evidence for individual rapes does not prove that no such deeds took place. … But there is a difference between making specific allegations of rape or sexual assault and charging that organized mass rape was a central component of an operation meticulously planned over the course of years. Israel’s evidence of the latter comes nowhere near to measuring up to its claims.

              • Linkerbaan@lemmy.worldOPEnglish
                56·
                9 months ago

                It debunks many of the rape cases by pointing out there is either evidence contradicting them, or by showing that the “witnesses” already have a reputation for lying. since they were the people that claimed they saw 40 beheaded babies and women cut open. Which did not happen according to the IDF themselves.

                For another list of massive inconsistencies there is also this article.

                • FlowVoid@lemmy.worldEnglish
                  34·
                  9 months ago

                  The article completely ignores one eyewitness I named above, Ron Fregle.

                  And it suggests that maybe Raz Cohen witnessed a rape not by Hamas, but by Palestinian civilians. Is that supposed to somehow better?

                  • Linkerbaan@lemmy.worldOPEnglish
                    56·
                    9 months ago

                    Because Ron Fregle was not even mentioned as a witness in the Screams without Words article. In fact when searching his name only irrelevant stuff comes up. Is he in any article or is it just that video?

                    After a million “witnesses” being exposed for making false statements you can’t seriously expect me to take these 'eyewitnesses" seriously anymore.

                    There are a lot of CCTV cameras in israel an somehow none of them manages to capture any rape? And there’s no forensic evidence? And all of the witnesses bring stories filled with holes or straight up lies?