While I think it’s just harmless fun, understand most of those criticizms. But the nazi comparisons seem sad and pathetic. Should every symbol the nazis tried to appropriate for themselves be surrendered to them? Should we give them the ability to limit what symbols the rest of us are allowed to use? I don’t think we should.
It has been a problem in particular with runes, as they are heavily associated with neo-nazis to the point where at least Scandinavians often feel very uncomfortable around it. Some participants in the debate in Norway are praising the team for reclaiming the symbolism from the nazis.
I personally agree that we cannot surrender our historical legacy to nazis, and I think it’s worth making active efforts to reclaim it. So I think this is a good thing, as long as the team also make sure to celebrate diversity and anti-fascism. I chose my user name here according to a similar logic.
Pretty much any group from history behaved terribly by modern standards. Even the colonized were doing their own colonizing before being overpowered by a more powerful colonizer.
I was talking about the symbolism associated with the viking cultures, not the way they conducted themselves when visiting neighbours. I wouldn’t want the majority of thar to be shelved off as nazism just because some germans a millenia later thought the letters and mythology looked cool and wanted them for themselves. Or should we ditch every aspect of mythology and folklore that the schizoid Himmler decided to take a fascination with?
I said it has overtones of all the above. I didn’t say its all nazism. Its very surprising to me that people have chosen to read that when the only person who said anything like that was someone else trying to put words in my mouth.
That one has basically no other associations in the western world and I’m not a hindu, so I don’t have a reason to. But pagan traditions, symbolism and mythology are a different matter. If you wish to label all of those as nazism, only the nazis will thank you for it.
Can you quote where I labelled them all the above as nazism please. You seem to have spent this entire conversation trying to put words in my mouth.
In fact, can you also quote where I said we need to throw out everything the nazis ever tried to claim while we’re here too please. I feel like you made that one up as well.
Your original response was “All of the above tbh.” to a list of critiques of the photoshoot. If you think that posing for a viking picture is too close to nazi symbolism, then why do you think that? I can’t see anything that would directly associate the picture with the german nazi party, or fascism in general.
The only explanation I could figure was that you think the nazi appropriation of the general aesthetic taints the whole concept of vikings with the nazi label. If my assesment is incorrect, then I do apologize. It’s just that that specific line of thinking is sadly somewhat common and is the core of a wider phenomenon of surrendering the symbols and aesthetics of many pre-christian traditions (particularly in northern Europe) to the nazis.
Big discussion in Norway atm about this aesthetic-- kitsch? camp? vulgar? too aryan? to chauvinistic? or just too close to nazi symbolism for comfort?
https://thevikingherald.com/article/the-vikings-return-to-america-norwegian-soccer-team-gets-in-the-world-cup-spirit/1395
https://www.dagbladet.no/sport/kritikkstorm-faen-sa-dum/84715979
All of the above tbh.
While I think it’s just harmless fun, understand most of those criticizms. But the nazi comparisons seem sad and pathetic. Should every symbol the nazis tried to appropriate for themselves be surrendered to them? Should we give them the ability to limit what symbols the rest of us are allowed to use? I don’t think we should.
It has been a problem in particular with runes, as they are heavily associated with neo-nazis to the point where at least Scandinavians often feel very uncomfortable around it. Some participants in the debate in Norway are praising the team for reclaiming the symbolism from the nazis.
I personally agree that we cannot surrender our historical legacy to nazis, and I think it’s worth making active efforts to reclaim it. So I think this is a good thing, as long as the team also make sure to celebrate diversity and anti-fascism. I chose my user name here according to a similar logic.
You’re right, it’s unfair on the scandiboos to associate brutal white slaver-colonisers with nazis.
Pretty much any group from history behaved terribly by modern standards. Even the colonized were doing their own colonizing before being overpowered by a more powerful colonizer.
Wow I really upset the scandiboos.
I was talking about the symbolism associated with the viking cultures, not the way they conducted themselves when visiting neighbours. I wouldn’t want the majority of thar to be shelved off as nazism just because some germans a millenia later thought the letters and mythology looked cool and wanted them for themselves. Or should we ditch every aspect of mythology and folklore that the schizoid Himmler decided to take a fascination with?
If you want to wear a swastika, that’s your choice to make. People will judge you for it though.
If a Hindu, Buddhist, or Jain puts a swastika outside their home, literally no one except an ignorant person would judge them for it.
We’re talking about Scandinavians using the viking aesthetic for a photoshoot. It’s not nazism.
I said it has overtones of all the above. I didn’t say its all nazism. Its very surprising to me that people have chosen to read that when the only person who said anything like that was someone else trying to put words in my mouth.
I don’t know, felt kind of cheap to me.
That one has basically no other associations in the western world and I’m not a hindu, so I don’t have a reason to. But pagan traditions, symbolism and mythology are a different matter. If you wish to label all of those as nazism, only the nazis will thank you for it.
Can you quote where I labelled them all the above as nazism please. You seem to have spent this entire conversation trying to put words in my mouth.
In fact, can you also quote where I said we need to throw out everything the nazis ever tried to claim while we’re here too please. I feel like you made that one up as well.
Your original response was “All of the above tbh.” to a list of critiques of the photoshoot. If you think that posing for a viking picture is too close to nazi symbolism, then why do you think that? I can’t see anything that would directly associate the picture with the german nazi party, or fascism in general.
The only explanation I could figure was that you think the nazi appropriation of the general aesthetic taints the whole concept of vikings with the nazi label. If my assesment is incorrect, then I do apologize. It’s just that that specific line of thinking is sadly somewhat common and is the core of a wider phenomenon of surrendering the symbols and aesthetics of many pre-christian traditions (particularly in northern Europe) to the nazis.