Comment on [email protected] by @[email protected] at: https://lemmy.world/post/40836743/21256978 For links to the songs see below. Note that apparently they typed out the whole thing on a cell-phone.
Basically, some people started incorporating gloomy aspects to punk aesthetics and music. Gloomy aspects from literature, film, tropes. Some were looking to express similar political sentiments but in a more metaphorical way, I suppose; that’s my impression, that there was an added element of artistry/artsy there. Some were looking to add also subjective themes (madness, unlove, etc.). Example (Bauhaus - In the Flat Field).
This gave us post-punk and similar sounds in the very late 70s and mostly early 80s. You probably know some bands that were influential. Example. (The Cure - The Hanging Garden).
Anyway, the mohawk grew longer, blacker. Still teased, often shaved, but creepier. The leyering in clothing also became blacker or creepier (transparent layers, protagonism of the net layers). Theatrical and extravagant outfits emerged, inspired by the decade’s fashion too. Example in music video A. (Alien Sex Fiend - R.I.P.).
Example in music video B. (Specimen - Kiss Kiss Bang Bang)Famously, the night club called “The Batcave” started reuniting bands and listeners, and in the 80s many countries had similar venues. A little more aggressive or punkier sound persisted with a genre called deathrock. There was now post-punk, deathrock, goth rock, darkwave (inspired by the synth-driven genres of the 80s), etc. Example A. (The Sisters of Mercy - Lucretia my Reflection)
Example B. (The Frozen Autumn - Is Everything Real?).The subculture was consolidated around these genres, and then the name “Goth” stayed, and then more communication and inspiration… And nowadays social media keeps many things alive through teachings in video and, I guess, text, like this one. Why? In part, because [context] a person that is new to all this world is called a “baby bat” and [/context] most Goths are protective and integrating of baby bats.
And that’s it. There was a good deathrock revival in the late 00s and early 10s. Example. (Cinema Strange - I Remember Tendon Water). And today there’s an obsession to bring back the original elements but it’s all still very different (and often cliched, which I don’t like, personally).
Here’s some Goth music from ‘recent’ years. (Lebanon Hanover - Gallowdance).
Another one. (Boy Harsher - Fate).
And another one. (The Cemetery Girlz - Broken Teeth)More knowledgeable Goths, correct or add as needed…
One of the things I’m missing on the Lemmy side of the fediverse is more in depth nuanced answers like this. One of my favorite parts of reddit was going into r/ space and finding Andromeda(can’t remember the exact username) explaining some crazy thing the JWST or Hubble just discovered because they were an actual astrophysicist or in some cases had actually worked on the project.
I know it’s a blessing and a curse to have a smaller user base but I miss the possibility of running into people smarter than me giving context and background on a subject that I am a layman or even unaware of in some cases. r/ economics was a great example of a place where I have very little background in, but find interesting enough to read the articles posted. I would then head to the comments to hope someone posted an eli5 or at least some related background information.
I’ve tried adding my own expertise to the mix, but my background is a niche military specialty so other than explaining the background of Warrant Officer Ridley from the movie Alien, I haven’t been able to add much of my own knowledge base.
Yeah, there are a fair number of hi-quality comments, but they’re often buried (like this one above - it was 3 deep in a shitposting community.) Also, if you see a post with a single comment, I often debate if it’s worth it to look, on the chance that it’s a high-quality comment.
my background is a niche military specialty
If you haven’t already, check out the various history & military history subs, most are listed here: https://piefed.social/f/pugmigration
😆
Yep, PJ is over many of them. I like @[email protected] and we get along fine. Others claim that they are difficult. But many that claim that, I find difficult as well. So YMMV. But PJ is always active with multiple history Menes and educational shit posts daily.
tbf, I absolutely can be difficult XD
Same lol. But that’s besides the point. 😉
I like how we’re doing screenshots now, apparently. And also copypasting the text. Sharing links to comments is not always straightforward in the threadiverse.
If this is interesting to people, def check out The Ongoing History of New Music podcast/radio show. Alan Cross is amazingly insightful on all things music and just great to listen to. And the show’s been going on since 1993!
Even more topically - it has a 7 part series on the “Post-Punk Explosion”, including an episode on Goth (https://www.ajournalofmusicalthings.com/the-ongoing-history-of-new-music-encore-presentation-the-post-punk-explosion-part-5-goth/)
Will have to check it out when I get home. Also to mention if video essays are more your jam. Trash Theory on YouTube has done some nice short dives as well. From things very pop to not.
Came here to mention Alan Cross, and you already did, and better than I wudda…
Thank you for the recommendation!
Third rec for Alan Cross. I used to listen to his show on CFNY circa 2000 and was pleased to rediscover his show via podcast.
Sex Pistols -> Joy Division -> The Cure.
I mean, The Cure’s first album is punk. They even reworked their punk songs into new wave/goth. Fascinating to contrast the punk and goth versions of their songs.
Also Siouxie (of the Banshees fame) was originally a Sex Pistols superfan.




