May your blade chip and shatter.

The EU should decouple from Israel.

Well they aren’t 90 year old vicars doing thought crimes, what did you expect.

The Evil Empire is overextending.

Boycott, Divest, Sanction.

Prosecute, Dismantle, Deradicalize.

Too many Lex Luthors walking around these days.

Maybe they should coordinate this with the EU and Canada to ram it through Trump’s tantrum.

As usual with Greek lawmaking, this is more a tactic to scare people and to use as a sledgehammer when the state wants to, rather than some grand scheme to force the population en masse to de-anonymize themselves. You have got to understand that Greece is undergoing democratic backsliding and was never a very strong rule or law state to begin with. Laws in Greece tend to be super strict but loosely enforced, which basically means the establishment, the police, the courts, can use them to throw the book at whomever they deem too dangerous. The Greek state is structurally incapable of being an actual totalitarian apparatus, but can be an effective authoritarian one when it needs to.

If the ICJ finds Israel guilty of genocide, then the entire German economic and legal system that supports Elbit will have been found to be in breach of the Genocide convention and these five people will be found to be acting in accordance with the obligation to prevent Genocide.

That’s where we’re at.

And let me guess, the proposed law does not criminalize anyone saying “Between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty” (Likud’77) or denying Palestinians the right to self-determination (there is no such thing as a state’s right to exist under international law, contrary to the very real right to self-determination, enshrined in the UN Charter, that Germany is a signatory to).

These jewish-supremacist idiots are fuelling anti-Semitism, while propping up a genocidal apartheid regime.

There are better and worse democracies. Overall, democracy this decade is on the decline: https://www.v-dem.net/publications/democracy-reports/

Obligatory mention of: “R Kelly is not a pedophile, technically speaking”

Maybe pull yourselves up by your bootstraps. You know, the whole “meritocracy” thing.

The less powerful and relevant the US become the more they will act like they are rulers of the world.

Bring back the concept of «Heresy». Because this is it.

“this kind of attitude is ridiculous and disconnected from the reality of Palestinians” this is you engaging in an argument on behalf of Palestinians and their reality

Got me. You’re right. I concede the point.

What I should have said is “they feel they’re doing the right thing within their reality we from the outside we should not judge them”.

For most of the other points, I’m not sure I have anything to add, it’s becoming belaboured at this point.

On the Trump analogy I think you’re wrong. On two counts.

First: For the sake of argument only I’m going to call the Palestinians engaging with what you call liberal Zionists “defeatists”. I’m not saying i see them as such but let’s use this word to caricature them. So: defeatists are nowhere near the same thing as collaborationists. Even if we agree that Abbas is acting as the long arm of Netanyahu, that’s not the same as the defeatists who see a human connection in grief and want to chant kumbaya with Israelis who oppose the genocide and the apartheid. That’s nowhere near the same. It’s a world of difference between active collaboration with a genocidal apartheid regime and the hosting of common events with people who also oppose that regime. Just like Palestinians are not a monolith, so aren’t Israelis.

Second: Yes, Trumpists get a say on a discussion about democracy. I’m not American, so I’ll extrapolate to my own contexts. Yes, far right nationalists, stupid as they are, are my co-citizens. So long as they’re not trying to do a coup, yes, they do belong in a discussion about democracy. I can’t flick my magic wand and make millions of right wingers disappear, so finding a way to have a discussion about the rules of the democratic game is absolutely important. I’m not saying anyone should be conceding any arguments to them. I do believe in the cordon sanitaire approach, and more crucially I believe in populist policies to “drain the swamp” on which the fascists feed. But you can’t mute and block your way out of proto-fascism.

Anyway, thanks for introducing me to Ghassan Kanafani, I didn’t know, holy shit.

I’m not going to enter into a discussion about the righteousness or the feasibility or political usefuless of this or that solution as my opinion on the matter ultimately doesn’t matter.

I will only point to this key phrase of what you wrote:

The existence of collaborators and propagandized Palestinians who aren’t well read on their own history (as a product of the ongoing colonization) doesn’t mean the “jury is out on the debate”, they aren’t part of the debate.

Because this what it boils down to, right? Palestinians are not a monolith, even if you, a Palestinian, cast out of the story some (a few?) other Palestinians as irrelevant to recreate a kind of monolith that you can call “a very mature body of literature” (and whoever is outside that is “not part of the debate”, i.e., outside the monolith).

And here’s the thing. You can do that. I can’t. You have a “we” to refer to. I don’t. I only have a “you” (the plural you, vous, εσεις). So, I don’t have the standing to take this step and label Palestinians who don’t share your political vision as “collaborators” and “propagandized” even if yours is the majority opinion. Small example: the Barghouthis are calling for releasing Marwan Barghouthi as a step to revive the two state solution. Am I to start going around like an asshole calling Marwan fucking Barghouthi a propagandized collaborator? You can, without being an asshole. I can’t. Same with the people whose event the other commenter called a joke. You can call them a joke. The other commenter can’t.

So, I am also not going to start going around like a western asshole shitting on people on the ground who risk their safety, going against the genocidal Israeli right on a project of shared grief like this. In the exact same way that I don’t go around blanketly condemning groups that take on armed struggle to exercise the Palestian people’s legal right to armed resistance to occupation under international law.

And for the same reason, I’m going to call the other commenter out, just like I would (and have) call out someone for blanketly denouncing Palestinian armed resistance.

Yet you feel compelled as an outsider to speak with such authority and conviction.

I don’t claim authority. I do claim the conviction of my own ideas and a measure of consistency in their application.

If Italy accepts they will be made fun of for the next 50 years.

There is a difference between you making those judgement calls within your own community and us from outside picking and choosing good and bad Palestinians. The commenter I responded to above has no standing to condemn the people that pour their energy in organizing this event.

In fact from where I’m standing I’m seeing the genocidal Israeli right getting pissed off by this and trying to violently shut it down, so they must be doing something right. Such as:

The ceremony offered bereaved Israeli and Palestinian families a rare space to jointly mourn loved ones lost to the conflict, and to raise their voices in calling for an end to war and Israeli occupation.

And there is a distinction between goals, strategy and tactics. The right of return and reparations are goals. These kinds of initiatives are tactics. And you can meaningfully debate with other Palestinians their efficacy or on diversity of tactics but I don’t think the jury is out on that debate, such that would compel outsiders to declare something like this a meaningless joke.

I could quote to you parts of the article that explain why this kind of attitude is ridiculous and disconnected from the reality of Palestinians and Israelis that organize with personal danger against the apartheid and occupation but I’d end up copying the entire article. Go read it before playing the edgelord.