Eh, if they were going to lie they’d have said relations between fascist A and fascist B are as good as ever. There’s no sense in putting out something like this unless it’s the truth.

Eh, not exactly. Netanyahu is the one running Israel, and he’s making plenty of unforced errors on the international PR front, but a lot of what Israel is currently hated for would’ve happened no matter who was in charge. There’s no realistic timeline where Israel doesn’t commit genocide in Gaza; the best case scenario is that the genocide ends by late 2024 rather than getting an intermission in late 2025-early 2026. The only parts of Netanyahu’s conduct that don’t reflect the views of the Israeli public and political establishment are the bad PR and ignoring the hostages; putting Gazans in their place via blood and iron is largely uncontroversial.

TL;DR: Netanyahu’s unforced errors are making Israel more hated than it’d have otherwise been, but the core reasons for international public opinion turning against it would’ve been there no matter who was in charge.

Counterpoint: Countries are fully capable of being cancers. Case in point: Israel.

Unfortunately most of the Middle East is run by US puppets, so Hezbollah/Lebanon can expect very little external aid from countries not named Iran. Syria’s current government would also (quite justifiably) rather die than give Hezbollah any support. There’s just not enough juice in Lebanon for a Ukraine. A Vietnam is absolutely possible if they tey to occupy territory though.

I… uh… think the Dutch ruling class is quite used to being on the wrong side of history.

In the same breath you call Hillary a terrible politician then admit you weren’t around so you don’t know any details.

I mean yes; I know the gist of why she was a terrible politician but I’d have to do some research to provide receipts like I could do for Harris on the spot.

You are underestimating how many people in the right geographical areas of this country will NEVER vote for a woman for president.

Then enlighten me? How many people in the right geographic areas of this country will never vote for a woman for president? Surely someone has already answered such a high-stakes question.

It’s not a matter of liberals admitting it, it’s that Isreal ramped up and ran out of targets with any military association but kept bombing.

See, you’re proving my point. That’s exactly what was happening under Biden. The UN was warning of a famine as early as mid-2024. Biden himself said Rafah was a humanitarian red line and proceeded to do nothing when Israel took it. If your point is that Israel was engaging in legitimate self-defense until November, then kindly fuck off.

There were so many obvious lies being pushed by both sides that even the extent of Isreal’s atrocities was questionable back then.

No it fucking wasn’t. People were yelling as loud as they could that Israel’s conduct was genocidal as early as October 9th 2023.

I mean sure you can find people who think or do basically anything; I haven’t seen any evidence that this is a significant group of people, even though if it was it’d show up on polls before and after the election. I’d also bet good money no such evidence exists, because if it did libs wouldn’t shut up about it. Meanwhile plenty of evidence exists that the most significant factors in Harris’s loss were the genocide and her being a rightwing ghoul.

times were a bit different then, that was before Isreal just started to murder civilians blatantly en mass.

No, it’s just before liberals started admitting that Israel was blatantly murdering civilians en masse. This had a lot more to do with a Republican being in charge than the actual blatant mass murder of civilians, which had been going on since October 2023.

And I wonder why?

Because you like Harris and don’t want to accept that someone can have a valid reason to hate her guts.

This is more of a rant than a response to anything I actually said.

all of them were objectively worse off.

I generally agree with you, but I thought real wages went up under Biden for low income earners? What metric are you using here?

We’re not talking about the right, though; we’re talking about the left and center. You know, the people who voted for Obama, and who would be expected to vote for a Democratic candidate. Why even care what the right thinks?

Acting like it’s currently the environment of 2008 is blind.

Sure, but that cuts both ways. Just like the right is more fascist today, the left and center-left are more progressive and more willing to listen to radical voices. Your implicit assumption that all of America shifted rightwards doesn’t match up with reality.

convince too many leftists that there’s something wrong with her for some reason.

I mean there is plenty wrong with her (TropicalDingdong makes a good case in that regard), but she’s the best realistic option barring a new national-scale Mamdani.

I mean do you even have reasons for thinking Harris was so bad?

Yes, plenty in fact.

Copy paste from elsewhere in the thread.

You seem well-meaning, but the racism/sexism card is way overplayed at this point in the game. The two examples DNC sympathisers point to for why an AOC run is a bad idea both lost not because they were women, but because they were utterly terrible politicians. I wasn’t around for Hillary so I can’t go into too much detail, but Harris specifically did her utmost best to destroy every single ounce of goodwill she had. And as for the racism, well, America did overwhelmingly elect Obama in 2008. Even on the far right you see MAGA elect women and minority politicians they agree with (see: MTG), so there’s no way the everyone left of Reagan coalition wouldn’t be able to elect AOC due to sexism. It’s just a complete and utter non-issue.

You seem well-meaning, but the racism/sexism card is way overplayed at this point in the game. The two examples DNC sympathisers point to for why an AOC run is a bad idea both lost not because they were women, but because they were utterly terrible politicians. I wasn’t around for Hillary so I can’t go into too much detail, but Harris specifically did her utmost best to destroy every single ounce of goodwill she had. And as for the racism, well, America did overwhelmingly elect Obama in 2008. Even on the far right you see MAGA elect women and minority politicians they agree with (see: MTG), so there’s no way the everyone left of Reagan coalition wouldn’t be able to elect AOC due to sexism. It’s just a complete and utter non-issue.

I mean why would they pay taxes if they’re not a money-making enterprise?

They’re not incompetent (well they’re that too, but not just incompetent); they’re also controlled opposition. What you see here is their job.

Except for all the times you negotiate with terrorists. “Never negotiate with terrorists” is what oppressors do when they don’t want to negotiate with the oppressed (who may or may not be terrorists), not a strategy anyone has ever seriously implemented.

That’s so surprising, I am shocked. I wonder if anyone could’ve predicted this.

That makes a lot more sense.